Curious for the MSRP only crowd

[Sisyphus]

Originally Posted by RolexSimon

I think this myth of ADs selling to Grey's direct is not backed up by any hard evidence. Rolex are actively blocking individuals who flip to Greys as they can find out the serial numbers without too much hassle. imagine if they caught an AD doing this? It's just too serious an issue for an AD to risk loosing their AD Rolex status for. I'm happy to eat my words if anyone has any REAL evidence this is what's happening. Unscrupulous individuals who go to several ADs and wait until they get a watch then flip them immediately, knowing they will never go back to the same AD again - that's far more likely to be the real scenario.

Well, the way I imagine this working is that an AD could have customers,ie. a rep of a grey dealer, spending millions per year on product. The AD would be in a difficult financial situation to send this client away as not only does he buy the precious ss models, but also a lot of « non-desired stock ».

Under the assumption that grey dealers would actually source product from several ADs, it would be difficult for Rolex to impose any penalties on the AD itself.

It goes along the lines of your thinking, just at another scale (find it difficult to believe that the current grey offer has been sourced by individuals queuing up for years to get a Daytona).

Cheers,


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[greggywatchguy]

I would pay what the Rolex AD charged me when I picked up my watch (even if msrp was much higher than now) or I would wait and buy other luxury goods. I wouldn’t buy outside of an AD or boutique. My mailbox is not an elegant shopping experience like getting one from the boutique. Rolexes are special luxury goods and with all luxury goods I buy I want the luxury experience. The way they size it for you, explain the features, and wrap it, also often giving you little gifts as well (watchwinders in my case). It all adds to the memory of acquiring the piece. If Rolex fails to give me that I’ll head to VC or Cartier. Also I have to know it’s authentic.

[subdownunder]

I recently paid $1,000 above MRP for a 1 month old Explorer 2.

Why? 5 years ago I promised my son his first Rolex upon graduation from Masters Engineering and securing his first job.
Promise was more important than the $1,000

Would I otherwise?
Hell no. I do not support scalpers and flippers who see a quick dollar and the expense of people like me who desire the watch for long term ownership or a special gift.

[IR201]

Originally Posted by subdownunder

I recently paid $1,000 above MRP for a 1 month old Explorer 2.

Why? 5 years ago I promised my son his first Rolex upon graduation from Masters Engineering and securing his first job.
Promise was more important than the $1,000

Would I otherwise?
Hell no. I do not support scalpers and flippers who see a quick dollar and the expense of people like me who desire the watch for long term ownership or a special gift.

Awesome delivering on that promise for your son!

If I understand your position then, you would pay above MSRP if you felt you had a legitimate reason, but would not otherwise?

[fsprow]

Originally Posted by greggywatchguy

I would pay what the Rolex AD charged me when I picked up my watch (even if msrp was much higher than now) or I would wait and buy other luxury goods. I wouldn’t buy outside of an AD or boutique. My mailbox is not an elegant shopping experience like getting one from the boutique. Rolexes are special luxury goods and with all luxury goods I buy I want the luxury experience. The way they size it for you, explain the features, and wrap it, also often giving you little gifts as well (watchwinders in my case). It all adds to the memory of acquiring the piece. If Rolex fails to give me that I’ll head to VC or Cartier. Also I have to know it’s authentic.

Personally, I prefer to skip the “luxury experience” and just make a deal, usually from a great reseller, and get the watch in the mail. I prefer to size it myself and the goodies are of no interest. Different strokes as they say.

[srvrf]

I think that there’s also a stage of collecting aspect to this. If you bought before the craze or if you’ve been fortunate enough to get 1-2 hot watches at MSRP, I think you’d be reluctant to pay a premium. Personally, I am limiting myself to MSRP or less because the last thing I need is another watch. If I get anything else, it better be both a great watch and a great deal. There’s nothing more to it for me.


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[greggywatchguy]

Originally Posted by fsprow

Personally, I prefer to skip the “luxury experience” and just make a deal, usually from a great reseller, and get the watch in the mail. I prefer to size it myself and the goodies are of no interest. Different strokes as they say.

Yes, there are many good ways to go depending on what someone prefers!

[airchitect]

Not one red cent over msrp for me. It’s a matter of principle.


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[ThatOtherGuy7]

Originally Posted by airchitect

Not one red cent over msrp for me. It’s a matter of principle.


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This! I don’t think I have ever paid over MSRP for anything. Usually it is bought at a discount. Rolex is probably the first luxury item that I had to pay MSRP for.

[teck21]

Originally Posted by srvrf

I think that there’s also a stage of collecting aspect to this. If you bought before the craze or if you’ve been fortunate enough to get 1-2 hot watches at MSRP, I think you’d be reluctant to pay a premium. Personally, I am limiting myself to MSRP or less because the last thing I need is another watch. If I get anything else, it better be both a great watch and a great deal. There’s nothing more to it for me.


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A whole new breed of Rolex buyers have become accustomed to paying a premium, either outright from greys or from bundling/relationship building.

This is the normal they know, in the way discounts are a normal to an older generation of buyers.


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[kizerman]

Originally Posted by Santiago32

I never understood folks only willing to pay MSRP but developing spend history on unwanted items.

Wouldn't grey be cheaper at that point?

The unwanted items argument is a joke. Any decent AD doesn't ask that of customers and there are plenty of buyers to back that up here.

Buying a grey piece is buying a used piece, no matter what anyone says. Therefore the chain of custody has been broken and there is no way to know for sure who has touched that watch and if they have opened it or not or if all parts are still original.

I'd rather wait a month or so and get what I want from my AD.

[kizerman]

Originally Posted by GST15

I have 5 Rolex, all from AD at MSRP within past 18 months. Never bought another item from the store. Some here laugh at forming a relationship, but that is the way it is done. Nothing more than building a friendship, which I have done with my SA, just like the one I have with the clerk at the coffee shop. It costs nothing to be friendly, sincere, and build a trust relationship.

Same here, 5 Rolex, all desirable sport models, in last 18 months. No other purchases and all easy transactions. To those who are waiting years, I say you are probably not as nice or as charming as you think you are.

If you are personable and real, a good AD will get you what you what you want in a reasonable amount of time.

[IR201]

Originally Posted by kizerman

The unwanted items argument is a joke. Any decent AD doesn't ask that of customers and there are plenty of buyers to back that up here.

Buying a grey piece is buying a used piece, no matter what anyone says. Therefore the chain of custody has been broken and there is no way to know for sure who has touched that watch and if they have opened it or not or if all parts are still original.

I'd rather wait a month or so and get what I want from my AD.

Do grey dealers not ensure the integrity of the pieces they sell?

[xrole]

Originally Posted by Equity

I can’t imagine being manipulated to buy a luxury item.

One could argue that if you are paying an AD £10k+ for something that costs less than £1k to manufacture then you have already been manipulated anyway. Grey dealers are just another level of stupid in terms of buyer manipulation because buying from them is the very definition of FOMO.

[Golfbone]

Originally Posted by GST15

I have 5 Rolex, all from AD at MSRP within past 18 months. Never bought another item from the store. Some here laugh at forming a relationship, but that is the way it is done. Nothing more than building a friendship, which I have done with my SA, just like the one I have with the clerk at the coffee shop. It costs nothing to be friendly, sincere, and build a trust relationship.

This is what I have done as well. 5 Rolex pieces in last 2 years (2 Daytona, 2 OP and a blue Sky D). Have bought a few other trinkets for my wife but nothing over 10 K in the last 5 years....just the usual anniversary, birthday bracelet or necklace for 1 to 3 K. Good relationship and when I let him know what I want he calls me within a few months and I'm there with a check to pick it up the same or next day. I feel good about buy a Daytona or Sky d at the list price but I don't think I would feel so wonderful about getting fleeced by aftermarket re sellers who are making far more profit off my investment than Rolex is or I ever will.

[jimcameron]

Each person has their own limit. It's a wonderful thing.

[garyk]

I have gone grey a couple of times over the years, only once for a Rolex and at retail price for a new unworn piece. I wouldn’t mind a small increase over retail but in the case of a watch that’s selling for double, I would feel like an idiot doing that. I’ve worked hard for my money and that sounds like going to a casino and blowing a fortune!

[PhilippeD]

I'm lucky I'm mostly attracted to the "lesser wanted" models, such as the 126660 and 226570 black dial. I got those by just walking into the AD, order, wait a few weeks, and there they are. No need to go grey.

If you're talking about the more popular models, like a Batman/Daytona, I'd probably pay no more than 10-15% above MSRP. Like said by someone else; The Daytona is not a 35k watch, and the Batman is not a 18-20k watch (in MY opinion).

[subdownunder]

Originally Posted by IR201

Awesome delivering on that promise for your son!

If I understand your position then, you would pay above MSRP if you felt you had a legitimate reason, but would not otherwise?

As a general rule I prefer not to support a situation where people seek arbitrage by gaming the market for a quick buck (how many new Rolexes are finding their way to the Grey market with tags and stickers? Obviously flippers or shady dealings by AD's going on).

But nothing is black and white. In my situation, after waiting 2 years via normal channels it was either $1,000 or a broken promise after my son upheld his part of the arrangement. In this situation $1,000 premium was a good tradeoff. Were it double the price of the Explorer 2 then maybe not.

Only the individual can determine their person boundaries, when its not an illegal or morally wrong decision. Mine was an unkept promise vs $1,000.

[RyanJ]

Originally Posted by IR201

For those who refuse to pay over retail on Rolex, I'm genuinely curious as to this hypothetical:

Would you pay 10,000 USD plus tax for a BLRO, if you wanted one?

or 13,500 USD plus tax for a ceramic daytona, if you wanted one?

Or is it a matter of principle and you'd rather wait for years possibly than pay literally 1 cent over MSRP?

The only reason people are paying over MSRP is because of the value of Rolex watches. When Rolex watches were readily available, no one paid over MSRP. If Rolex watches could not be re-sold for what you paid or more than what you paid; no one would be rushing to pay over MSRP. People say they do not care about the "money" part of Rolex but that is mostly a lie. I would argue most absolutely care about value retention. It is one of the biggest selling points of a Rolex.

I will not and have never paid over MSRP. I have gotten all the watches I wanted within a month or two. Granted, I dont like many Rolex models which helps. Explorer, DateJust, and a DayDate are the only 3 I would wear. Nothing against the other models, I just prefer other brands.

[kizerman]

Originally Posted by IR201

Do grey dealers not ensure the integrity of the pieces they sell?

Using the words grey and integrity in the same sentence is absurd. They are used car salesmen.

A watch bought from a grey dealer is a used watch no matter how many seals are on it. 99.9% of the grey buyers would never know if their watch was altered at all, if it was opened or if any movement alterations were made.
Buying a used rolex is crazy. Paying 2x retail for a used rolex is moronic.

[Nairn1980]

Originally Posted by kizerman

Using the words grey and integrity in the same sentence is absurd. They are used car salesmen.

A watch bought from a grey dealer is a used watch no matter how many seals are on it. 99.9% of the grey buyers would never know if their watch was altered at all, if it was opened or if any movement alterations were made.
Buying a used rolex is crazy. Paying 2x retail for a used rolex is moronic.

Pretty disrespectful to single out lack of integrity. There are good and bad in all industries. Most grey dealers I know run great businesses and act with integrity. Incidentally, most “used car salesmen” I know are absolutely the same. Working hard and providing for their family, likely the same as you.

[Andrews148]

Not one penny over retail, on principle.

[Andad]

Originally Posted by kizerman

Using the words grey and integrity in the same sentence is absurd. They are used car salesmen.

A watch bought from a grey dealer is a used watch no matter how many seals are on it. 99.9% of the grey buyers would never know if their watch was altered at all, if it was opened or if any movement alterations were made.
Buying a used rolex is crazy. Paying 2x retail for a used rolex is moronic.

Banned? That was no surprise.

[xrole]

Originally Posted by Andad

Banned? That was no surprise.

What he said in that particular post (I would be shocked if that particular post got him banned) was bang on point and correct.

[KeobNepo]

Originally Posted by xrole

What he said in that particular post (I would be shocked if that particular post got him banned) was bang on point and correct.

Agreed!! This can not be the post to be banned.


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[Bigsoftee]

I don’t like to buy grey, prefer to be the first owner of the watch. Only ever gone to an AD.

[JakeK]

Interesting question. I’m in the msrp + tax camp. There are very few things I can’t wait for, watches are not one of them.

[IamJacky]

Originally Posted by xrole

What he said in that particular post (I would be shocked if that particular post got him banned) was bang on point and correct.

Not going to argue about the part where he said buying grey is buying used, but how is saying all grey dealers have no integrity, and that anyone who buys grey is crazy or even a moron bang on point and correct?

[dannyp]

Originally Posted by Santiago32

I never understood folks only willing to pay MSRP but developing spend history on unwanted items.

Wouldn't grey be cheaper at that point?

Originally Posted by Bigsoftee

I don’t like to buy grey, prefer to be the first owner of the watch. Only ever gone to an AD.

I think that the “buying pieces you don’t want” scenario is more easily explained in reference to those who use “msrp-only” as a proxy for “AD-only” (like me).

Might also apply to those who see desirable watches more as trophies, where being “offered” the watch by an AD is part of the “trophy” itself.