Dear Rolex: You are a Joke

[chiko323]

Originally Posted by kneedeep

Same as Patek with 5711s. Create overwhelming demand by limiting supply to a relatively large pool of interested buyers. As the pool of interested buyers shrinks for any number of reasons i.e. economy, demographics, consumer trends and preferences, etc. that marketing strategy expires. In the meantime, we are stuck with it like it or not with the option to spend our money elsewhere.

Last week I was chatting with a Patek AD about the blue 5711 and was told that they get two per year and have a waiting list with 100 names on it. My math tells me that's a 50 year wait list .

[jon_jon]

I remember back in the 2000s, there were long waits for the 116520. Then the Great Recession struck and the demand decreased. Many Rolex ADs went out of business during the recession. The wait for a 116520 became more reasonable. And by adding a ceramic bezel, the 116500 rewinds the clock and we are back to the SS Daytona market of 10 years ago.

It is frustrating for people who are not used to being told "no" in other aspects of our lives to experience this at a luxury goods store. But even in the luxury goods market, there is a supply and demand and the final price of a product on the free market (i.e. secondary market) will be based on that supply/demand imbalance. There are obviously people paying a 30-50% premium to purchase the watch on the secondary market and I am sure many forum members have flipped this watch for a quick buck. All I can say is that capitalism is certainly alive and kicking in the Swiss watch industry.

I decided to back off on the 116500 for now and just enjoy my 116520. I really don't see the big difference between the 116500 and the 116520 that everyone is talking about.

[Formulansx]

If only it were socially acceptable to put an aftermarket ceramic bezel on your existing Daytona.........

[Dr. Robert]

I decided to buy a couple of chronographs from other marques......5,6,7 years....
I can't wait that long, I might be dead by then.

[Gaijin]

Totally agree Seth.

I played this game with the SS Daytona in 2005. Got jerked around both by Rolex and my AD.

As Jon Jon said above then the crash/recession hit.

My AD went out of business and I could care less about a SS Daytona.

[Andad]

Well Seth,

I am struggling to understand why you are even here on TRF complaining about Rolex.
You don't own one?

I have been through Singapore and Vietnam over the past few weeks and have been offered a black Daytona C (I want a white) and a two BLNR's all at US listed prices and I have a few days to decide.

Don't bother replying - I won't see you anymore

Tom et al are entitled to their own opinion on your ramblings.

Get out more?

Just went back to the AD for a wrist pix of the C.

Just wished it was white

[mfluder]

Yeah I can relate. Dropped in to the largest Rolex boutique in Sydney.

Keep in mind there are only 4 Rolex ADs in a city of 5+ million.

Upon asking to see the steel sports watches - I noticed the sales assistant 'almost' imperceptibly roll her eyes.

I would have been inclined to take offence had I not realised that what she was next to say would be something she must say to a thousand customers every day:

"Our sports watches are over here, and as you'll notice we don't have very much to offer....."

The cabinet was stocked exclusively with precious metal offerings: WG GMT, YG Subs etc.

"The watches you mentioned earlier (Submariner, GMT, Sea-Dweller) - we only got about 1 a month, so as you'd imagine our waitlists are very long".

1 watch a month.... from 1 of the 4 dealers serving 5 million. Extraordinary.

[AK797]

It's going to get to the point where new buyers to Rolex in the UK and Aus will only see sports PMs in ADs and think no wonder this brand has such high status, they don't even bother making SS.

[Smarties]

Originally Posted by mfluder

Yeah I can relate. Dropped in to the largest Rolex boutique in Sydney.

Keep in mind there are only 4 Rolex ADs in a city of 5+ million.

Upon asking to see the steel sports watches - I noticed the sales assistant 'almost' imperceptibly roll her eyes.

I would have been inclined to take offence had I not realised that what she was next to say would be something she must say to a thousand customers every day:

"Our sports watches are over here, and as you'll notice we don't have very much to offer....."

The cabinet was stocked exclusively with precious metal offerings: WG GMT, YG Subs etc.

"The watches you mentioned earlier (Submariner, GMT, Sea-Dweller) - we only got about 1 a month, so as you'd imagine our waitlists are very long".

1 watch a month.... from 1 of the 4 dealers serving 5 million. Extraordinary.

I don't think she's telling the truth! Impossible to have only 1 Sub, GMT, and SD per month!

[Chiboy]

Originally Posted by AK797

It's going to get to the point where new buyers to Rolex in the UK and Aus will only see sports PMs in ADs and think no wonder this brand has such high status, they don't even bother making SS.

Maybe it will get to the point where, based on current currency valuations, Rolexes in the UK and Australia and elsewhere will be priced on an equivalent basis with the rest of the world. Then demand will be lower, and Rolex will not face the difficult decision of "Do I sell this watch to a dealer in the US and make XXXX, or sell it to a dealer in the UK and make 30% (or whatever) less?"

Higher supply, lower demand, fewer complaints.

[watchwatcher]

I'll play semantics here. "Joke?" No...don't think so.

"Game-playing-so-you-can-create-hype-and-the ever popular-mystique?" Sure.

But hey, I'm sure their business strategists know what they're doing. One year plus past Basel and it's still commanding a hefty premium over MSRP on the secondary market. Impressive.

[904VT]

I get why they would want to restrict supply of the 116500. Between driving sales up the model range and branding "goodwill" all benefit Rolex. But is upping production to make availability similar to Hulk and BLNR really too much to ask from Rolex from a supply/demand perspective.

A few months, 6 months, maybe a year all reasonable to wait for a highly demanded watch. Once we start getting into the years something is out of whack. Either a company can't evolve their tooling and production technologically to keep up with production, the company finds it unprofitable because of marginal utility, or the company believes it will garner intangible benefits, such as branding equity.

Got to believe it's branding equity for Rolex. Can we please just for once have a reasonable SS Daytona Supply/Demand function Rolex, just once do we have to beg already, make things reasonable

[AK797]

Originally Posted by Chiboy

Maybe it will get to the point where, based on current currency valuations, Rolexes in the UK and Australia and elsewhere will be priced on an equivalent basis with the rest of the world. Then demand will be lower, and Rolex will not face the difficult decision of "Do I sell this watch to a dealer in the US and make XXXX, or sell it to a dealer in the UK and make 30% (or whatever) less?"

Higher supply, lower demand, fewer complaints.

Yes, a price rise is due, AP have had 2 since Brexit, but Rolex are slower to act and more conservative so can't see one before the Autumn, ie within 1 year of the last one.

[Corey79]

So what kinda price are we talking if agreeing to an 8yr wait?
I saw a website (Swiss luxury.com) selling them for 30K, marked down fron 37K

Sent from my SM-G360G using Tapatalk

[speedmaster73]

why is anyone comparing Patek to Rolex??

Patek makes approx 50000 watches per year

Rolex makes 1000000 watches per year

so please....stop.....the daytona is not comparable to the nautilus

the daytona compares much closer to the omega 8500 based speedmaster from Omega

Patek is Haute Horology

Patek IS exclusive

Rolex is not....its mainstream.....

[blue16613]

Originally Posted by speedmaster73

why is anyone comparing Patek to Rolex??

Patek makes approx 50000 watches per year

Rolex makes 1000000 watches per year

so please....stop.....the daytona is not comparable to the nautilus

the daytona compares much closer to the omega 8500 based speedmaster from Omega

Patek is Haute Horology

Patek IS exclusive

Rolex is not....its mainstream.....

Yep, Monsieur Theirry is just a "chip of the old block." (Not!!!)

[Canook]

Originally Posted by speedmaster73

why is anyone comparing Patek to Rolex??

Patek makes approx 50000 watches per year

Rolex makes 1000000 watches per year

so please....stop.....the daytona is not comparable to the nautilus

the daytona compares much closer to the omega 8500 based speedmaster from Omega

Patek is Haute Horology

Patek IS exclusive

Rolex is not....its mainstream.....

exactly!! totally agreed!!!

[Boopie]

Originally Posted by rolexnub

Thanks Seth aka Superdog for the rant.

It's about time we hear someone speak up against the Rolex marketing gimmick with regards to the Daytona watch. I was on waiting list for the white dial late last year but was told it could take me anywhere from 3-5 years to get my piece. So I told the AD to forget about it and take me off the list.

I agree, this is crazy. Here on the forum it's estimated that Rolex makes 1 million watches a year. This estimate is also in the Wristwatch Annual 2017. Do they make 5 Daytonas? These are not limited edition Ferraris. The same Wristwatch Annuak estimates that Patek makes about 45k watches a year.

[datejust24]

3-4K markup for a new ceramic bezel....sounds like its worth it to me!!!!!......

No, no its not.....it's absolutely RIDICULOUS....I truly don't care for any modern Daytona with crown guards....Now a vintage Daytona sans CG's....I'd love to have one....the prices are just through the roof. This AD salesman sounds as though he doesn't know his ass from his elbow.

[Lawman77]

Originally Posted by Chewbacca

i don't understand this thread.

X2. Exclusivity. Ego.
For crying out loud, every other thread on this forum is about someone putting IT out on the table for everyone to measure, compare, and take pictures.
Fancy wallets, super cars, wine collections, metal credit cards...

Brilliant marketing and business strategy. The fact this thread is 8 pages (and counting) helps prove the hype is real.

[rolexnub]

Originally Posted by Smarties

I don't think she's telling the truth! Impossible to have only 1 Sub, GMT, and SD per month!

She's probably referring to the Sub LVc and the GMT BLNR. From my experience, I know that ADs here in Vancouver (don't know the situation in other big cities of Canada) only get the Sub LVc once a month or once very two months and get the BLNR once a month. I don't know about the SD - probably a DeepSea D-Blue.

[emersm]

Originally Posted by superdog

I have not one Rolex in my collection currently. Largely because I do not like the brand.

Originally Posted by Maxy

Wow, didn't realize this. It changes the perception of the post from Rolex lover's rant to something else!

X2^^

[superdog]

Originally Posted by emersm

X2^^

Umm, a watch enthusiasts rant?

[Spectre007]

I know I'm late to the game on this but... it makes sense for a business.
In the long term.
Would you make more money being a tool watch company? Or money as the #1 name in luxury goods out of any brand on earth?
You can go to every country on the planet and the #1 most recognized brand associated with luxury is Rolex.
Whether it is for good or for bad, they have created that illusion.
It is one of the single greatest feats in modern marketing, no matter how shitty it is LOL
They are creating an artificial supply and demand and it has worked.
If we want them to stop doing this then everyone should stop buying them for a couple years and make them rethink their strategy

[drgoro]

Them and porsche....try ordering a gt3 same model year and feel my pain. lol

[tkerrmd]

Sorry Seth...gave mine to my son....

[zoenoadad]

Originally Posted by directioneng

Well Seth,

I am struggling to understand why you are even here on TRF complaining about Rolex.
You don't own one?

I have been through Singapore and Vietnam over the past few weeks and have been offered a black Daytona C (I want a white) and a two BLNR's all at US listed prices and I have a few days to decide.

Don't bother replying - I won't see you anymore

Tom et al are entitled to their own opinion on your ramblings.

Get out more?

Just went back to the AD for a wrist pix of the C.

Just wished it was white

You should really give the black dial some serious consideration. I initially wanted white but this black one has really grown on me, to the point now where I wouldn't trade straight-up for a white one. It's so understated yet so elegant yet so much fun...and hey, if you get it and don't like it, you can always just flip and make a profit!

[keithl]

Originally Posted by superdog

OK, sorry...I know I am going to piss off some people off with this. I really don't mean to. And I am sorry, but where else am I going to make this comment? I genuinely hope someone from Rolex sees this, even though I am quite certain they could not care less.

I am out of state on business. And after my conference, a buddy and I decide to walk the strip. Of course we see a Rolex store and decide to browse. We meet a really excellent sales guy. He was not overly knowledgable about certain details, but he was polite, attentive and definitely good at what he does.

I finally see the new WG Daytona in blue, which is really an astonishing watch. Anyone out there wearing this watch.... Wow. It is incredible. And krioke, Rolex does blue exceptionally well.

We talk watches for a bit and of course we talk about the new Daytona C. So unless you have a prior sales experience with this AD you are not even on the list. It is not going to happen. Never, ever. If you have a prior sales experience with them, you are likely waiting 7 to 8 years.

OK, wait..what?

As Padi says, this is not a new watch. It is easy for them to make. They can fill the demand, sell a ton of watches and make ton of money...just like most businesses want to do.

They do this for their marketing machine. They do this to create the mystique. And I am sorry, but I just don't respect this. Be a watch company. Make great watches, make people happy selling them great watches.

Do I respect their watches? Yes, they make incredible watches. But this type of sales gimmick just turns me off. Big time. And they have gone from the "tool watch" company to the shiny "look at me" watch company.

I really do mostly love what they put out. And much of what they have has a great redeeming quality to it. But I am just not on board with this.

And yes yes yes...I know, if I don't like it, I should not buy it. Ok, I won't, and I can get one if I want one. It is a forum about Rolex watches and I am making a comment. If you want to respond in kind, great, it is a forum and I will respect and appreciate your opinion.

Sorry to anyone I offend. Rant over.

Apparently Rolex as a company can be D-bags, but that's their right, just like some Rolex owners can be D-bags, also their right.

[lig]

Sorry - didn't read through the entire thread.

Seth - I love you man but the irony here is delicious. *cough* GT350?

You are a resourceful fellow. You'll figure out a way to get the 116500 at MSRP.

And it'll be worth the wait.

Edit - I saw that you brought up your GT350 experience. In a similar fashion I was able to find a 116500 from an AD that didn't know me from Adam at MSRP.

My regular AD put me on his list and who knows how long it'll take but you know a lot of people in a lot of places.

A buddy of mine connected me with his AD in the Midwest. Gave 'em a deposit and 6 months later I've got the 116500.

Use your network!

[JasonKrick]

The 'scarcity' of Rolex models is self created by us consumers.

Rolex is a company and like any company needs to make a profit to operate and prosper.

By 'restricting' production of certain models, Rolex has mastered what companies dream of. Unending desire and demand of what was once considered a 'nice' watch.

I receive constant compliments from other Rolex fans on what is on my wrist.

Rolex nerds constantly came up to me when I wore my SS Daytona black dial. They want to see it no literally marvel it.

My favorite wrist piece right now is a DSSD Blue and nerds are now coming up to me to see this model.

I wore Tag for over a year and not one person stopped me to see my watch. Not that I care. I just find it interesting that I have never personally heard of someone with a Patek or Brueget get stopped to see their watch.

I wear my watches for me. And I like collecting the ones that appeal to me, whether scarce or not. I have a yachmaster with MOP diamond and sapphire dial. It has been discontinued and thus is rarer than any present Daytona. But I got it when stores couldn't give this model away. Huge discounts and there was one in every jewelry store I passed by.

Waiting 8 years for a watch is a long time. But that is part of the mystique if one chooses to go that route. I waited that long for the Daytona. And I got it while on vacation with my one day to be wife. Totally unexpected. And now, this Daytona has an extra special meaning permanently attached to it.

I collect watches with a meaning attached to it. Not just for the sake of having. That would be boring for me.