Is time running out for the Leap Second?

[bewithabob]

http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/19/world/...nds/index.html

Is time running out for the leap second? - CNN.com
By Dave Gilbert, CNN
2012-01-19T12:27:29Z
CNN.com
Is time running out for the leap second?

The future of the leap second is being decided in Geneva.
London (CNN) -- Thursday could be a key moment in the future of time keeping.
More than 100 countries are due to decide on whether to keep the present method of adding so-called leap seconds to the global time system at the Radiocommunications Assembly in Geneva, Switzerland.
Currently, this Co-ordinated Universal Time or UTC is based on a system of extremely accurate atomic clocks. But they are so precise that they do not match the rotation of the Earth which periodically speeds up and slows down due to the action of the tides and changes within the Earth's core.
Since 1972 these extra seconds are added or taken away from the timescale to make sure UTC is synchronized with the Earth's rotation.
Fifty years ago, a few seconds difference had less impact but many of our 21st century devices depend on incredible accuracy.
Peter Whibberley, senior research scientist in the Time Group at the UK's National Physical Laboratory, explains that people like astronomers also rely on this level of precision.
"There are many applications today that depend on precise time keeping. For example, telecommunications use atomic clocks to keep the networks around the world synchronized precisely together," he said. "Satellite navigation -- sat navs in our cars and homes -- depend on signals being sent out from atomic clocks on board satellites."
But now many countries, including the U.S. and most European nations, want to abandon the procedure which they say is too cumbersome.
According to Whibberley, precise timing systems can be disrupted by altering them.
The UK, Canada and China are pressing to keep the leap seconds when the issue is discussed at the U.N.'s International Telecommunications Union meeting on Thursday.
"Without a correction, eventually our clocks would show the middle of the day occurring at night," said Whibberley. "We have to have some means of making a correction but at the moment no one knows how that's going to be done."
Since 1972 Whibberley said only 24 leap seconds have been used and the rate has slowed because the Earth has been speeding up over the last few decades.
Without the leap seconds adjustment, the precise time measured by atomic clocks and time according to the Earth's rotation will start to deviate.
Although the tiniest inaccuracies might play havoc with our smart phones most of us would not notice the changes in our body clock -- it is estimated it will take more than 200 years to register an hour's difference.

[Rollie2011]

[Slinkey]

"Since 1972 Whibberley said only 24 leap seconds have been used and the rate has slowed because the Earth has been speeding up over the last few decades."

Not sure what we should be worried about, this is well within COSC guidelines.

[kkwn98]

This doesn't appear to have anything to do with Rolex...

[experimentjon]

Originally Posted by Slinkey

[I]
Not sure what we should be worried about, this is well within COSC guidelines.

Hahahahahaha. True that.

I read about this in the Economist last week. I believe the time difference over a VERY long time was going to somewhat large.

Still, as an auditor, I'm putting this variance as below materiality...pass on further testing. ;)

[GradyPhilpott]

This subject may not be Rolex related and therefore may be in the wrong forum, but it is a topic that should be of interesting to the WIS community.

Certainly, Rolex made its reputation in the early days on just how well their mechanical movements kept time as confirmed by astronomical readings.

Now for the first time in history, we stand ready to disconnect timekeeping with the rotation of the planet and base it entirely on the oscillations of a cesium atom.

Earlier, I made some comments on the subject here:

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=213373

As you can see, the subject is not exactly threatening to overload the servers.

It makes me wonder about the true interests of those who call themselves WISes.

Are we interested in time and timekeeping or fashion and branding?

[Lion]

Oh well, I do not plan on being around in 200 years!!!

[bewithabob]

Originally Posted by GradyPhilpott

This subject may not be Rolex related and therefore may be in the wrong forum, but it is a topic that should be of interesting to the WIS community.

Certainly, Rolex made its reputation in the early days on just how well their mechanical movements kept time as confirmed by astronomical readings.

Now for the first time in history, we stand ready to disconnect timekeeping with the rotation of the planet and base it entirely on the oscillations of a cesium atom.

Earlier, I made some comments on the subject here:

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=213373

As you can see, the subject is not exactly threatening to overload the servers.

It makes me wonder about the true interests of those who call themselves WISes.

Are we interested in time and timekeeping or fashion and branding?

The time has come for all good men to come to the aid of

[petesjag]

Interesting for Sure.. I may be dead in 200 years so I'm not Sure if I really need to worry about this problem..

[mike]

I moved it.

I was under the impression the leap second was necessary for GPS and so on so satellites could coordinate.

In any event it would mean NOT ONE of my watches would be correct.

[kkwn98]

Originally Posted by GradyPhilpott

This subject may not be Rolex related and therefore may be in the wrong forum, but it is a topic that should be of interesting to the WIS community.

Certainly, Rolex made its reputation in the early days on just how well their mechanical movements kept time as confirmed by astronomical readings.

Now for the first time in history, we stand ready to disconnect timekeeping with the rotation of the planet and base it entirely on the oscillations of a cesium atom.

Earlier, I made some comments on the subject here:

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=213373

As you can see, the subject is not exactly threatening to overload the servers.

It makes me wonder about the true interests of those who call themselves WISes.

Are we interested in time and timekeeping or fashion and branding?

I'll assume this is in response to my post above. If so, then I simply said it didn't appear to have anything to do with Rolex. What I didn't say, but left it as being understood, was that it was simply in the wrong forum, i.e. it should be in the open discussion forum. Not denying for one second that it's otherwise of interest. Just a bland statement suggesting it was in the wrong forum which I think (if you're responding to my post) you're reading too much into.

[blackmsport]

Unless I am a Formula 1 driver

1 sec is meaningless to me

[GradyPhilpott]

Originally Posted by kkwn98

I'll assume this is in response to my post above. If so, then I simply said it didn't appear to have anything to do with Rolex. What I didn't say, but left it as being understood, was that it was simply in the wrong forum, i.e. it should be in the open discussion forum. Not denying for one second that it's otherwise of interest. Just a bland statement suggesting it was in the wrong forum which I think (if you're responding to my post) you're reading too much into.

My previous post was not in response to your post. You were correct in your observation and I recognized that fact.

I was actually commenting on the general lack of interest in the subject matter by those who identify themselves by a obsession with timekeeping devices.

It is true than none of us who are reading this will be affected by the change in any real way, but certainly when the nature of timekeeping is so fundamentally altered after millenia of timekeeping being based on the apparent movement of the sun across the sky, it should be a matter of interest.

In the beginning of the use of UTC, those who navigate requested that leap seconds be inserted to aid in accurate navigation and to this day one can calculate UT-1 from UTC by listening to the double clicks in the WWV time broadcasts which indicate how many tenths of a second UTC is plus or minus UT-1, the navigational standard and one of the astronomical time scales.

Now there are other ways for ships and aircraft to compensate for the time differences and most of the nations in the world seem ready to condemn the leap seconds to the "ash heap of history."

That may be the most convenient thing to do and in fact it will negatively affect no one living today, but nonetheless, the separation of timekeeping from the rotation of the earth is a watershed event in that it will be the first time since the emergence on this planet of beings sentient enough to comprehend that abstract notion of time the the rotation of the earth and its observable effects have not been the universal standard for timekeeping.

If the change is approved next week, it will not go into effect until 2018.

[Bangel]

Originally Posted by GradyPhilpott

Now for the first time in history, we stand ready to disconnect timekeeping with the rotation of the planet and base it entirely on the oscillations of a cesium atom.

Sure none of us will be around, but it's fascinating for me to consider what sort of legacy we'll be leaving future (albeit possibly distant future) generations. The concept that a cesium atom and a sun dial could be measuring different things is something that I think challenges quite fundamental principles. Night could literally become day with the sun shining brightly when the clock says midnight!

[Bangel]

Originally Posted by GradyPhilpott

My previous post was not in response to your post. You were correct in your observation and I recognized that fact.

I was actually commenting on the general lack of interest in the subject matter by those who identify themselves by a obsession with timekeeping devices.

It is true than none of us who are reading this will be affected by the change in any real way, but certainly when the nature of timekeeping is so fundamentally altered after millenia of timekeeping being based on the apparent movement of the sun across the sky, it should be a matter of interest.

In the beginning of the use of UTC, those who navigate requested that leap seconds be inserted to aid in accurate navigation and to this day one can calculate UT-1 from UTC by listening to the double clicks in the WWV time broadcasts which indicate how many tenths of a second UTC is plus or minus UT-1, the navigational standard and one of the astronomical time scales.

Now there are other ways for ships and aircraft to compensate for the time differences and most of the nations in the world seem ready to condemn the leap seconds to the "ash heap of history."

That may be the most convenient thing to do and in fact it will negatively affect no one living today, but nonetheless, the separation of timekeeping from the rotation of the earth is a watershed event in that it will be the first time since the emergence on this planet of beings sentient enough to comprehend that abstract notion of time that the rotation of the earth and its observable effects have not been the universal standard for timekeeping.

If the change is approved next week, it will not go into effect until 2018.

Only just read this post after my previous post. I fully agree with all your sentiments. You say what I want to say only so much more eloquently than I can say it!!!

I had never heard of the leap second before stumbling across this thread, but I'll be following its fate very closely.

[GradyPhilpott]

Very well put, Bangel.

At last a breath of fresh air in a sea of apathy.

[kkwn98]

Originally Posted by GradyPhilpott

My previous post was not in response to your post. You were correct in your observation and I recognized that fact.

I was actually commenting on the general lack of interest in the subject matter by those who identify themselves by a obsession with timekeeping devices.

It is true than none of us who are reading this will be affected by the change in any real way, but certainly when the nature of timekeeping is so fundamentally altered after millenia of timekeeping being based on the apparent movement of the sun across the sky, it should be a matter of interest.

In the beginning of the use of UTC, those who navigate requested that leap seconds be inserted to aid in accurate navigation and to this day one can calculate UT-1 from UTC by listening to the double clicks in the WWV time broadcasts which indicate how many tenths of a second UTC is plus or minus UT-1, the navigational standard and one of the astronomical time scales.

Now there are other ways for ships and aircraft to compensate for the time differences and most of the nations in the world seem ready to condemn the leap seconds to the "ash heap of history."

That may be the most convenient thing to do and in fact it will negatively affect no one living today, but nonetheless, the separation of timekeeping from the rotation of the earth is a watershed event in that it will be the first time since the emergence on this planet of beings sentient enough to comprehend that abstract notion of time the the rotation of the earth and its observable effects have not been the universal standard for timekeeping.

If the change is approved next week, it will not go into effect until 2018.

My apologies.

It's a fascinating subject although, having done a bit of background reading on this, I'm really struggling to understand the need to tamper with the status quo - is it really "too cumbersome"?

[GradyPhilpott]

That's a good question.

They say that computer systems have to be reset every time a leap second is added (or subtracted, although this has never happened), but in the US at least, the National Institute of Standards and Technology provides numerous means for the public to access the correct time and it's no problem for my computers to sync automatically with NIST.

If there is in fact a good case to be made in this matter, I have yet to read one.

In fact, I found it frustrating that those who've written the articles that I've read seem to have no apparent understanding of the system at all.

[F&Iguy]

very Interesting