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tvbunk · 24 February 2008, 10:52 AM

I have an F serial numbered Sub. It is a 14060 no date M series. What is the difference between the Z and the M series.....By the way I traded my old 5513 I got in Hong Kong in 1969 for it even up brand new in the box with papers....

Scooby · 24 February 2008, 10:56 AM

Not sure I follow. You have an F series sub but it as an M 14060? That's 2 different watches, no?

Aside from that, I do not believe there is much difference between the Z and M seies, other than the newest 14060models are COSC certified (probably only the M's, but it could have started earlier, or later, meaning not all the M's).

Also, what kind of condition was the 5513 in? Because if it was in good condition, there are alot of guys drooling for one of that vintage.

Oh, congrats and welcome to the circus!

unclesallie · 24 February 2008, 12:19 PM

yeah, not sure i follow either. try this link:http://www.qualitytyme.net/pages/numbers.html

when you go there, scroll down and you will see what we are talking about.
best, dan

steel4me · 24 February 2008, 12:29 PM

I do not think they made 14060 in M series. However the complete designation of the 14060 is 14060M ..... for some reason the no date sub's model number is 14060M .... so having an F series 14060M is perefectly legit....but saying 14060M is 14060 M series is not correct ....

Tools · 24 February 2008, 12:34 PM

tv,

Welcome to the Forum.

If you have an "F" serial non-date Sub, then you have the 14060M reference. This model followed the 14060 after an upgrade in the movement and the M stands for "modified".

A "Z" or an "M" Sub would be one with a serial number starting with those letters. They would all be 14060M's.

As far as trading a 5513 for it, the fervor for vintage Subs are driving the value of excellent examples of those up and up..

The new 14060M gives you the modern equivalent of the old classic with Luminova markers, sapphire crystal, and a modern movement....This one should last you for another 40 years too.

mike · 24 February 2008, 12:42 PM

I think I see what's going on here. I believe the poster is saying he has an F series 14060M.

The 14060 replaced the 5513 circa 1989-90. Changes included a fast beat 3000 movement. About 2001 the reference was upgraded to the 14060M (for modified) indicating an upgrade in the movement to the current 3130.

The reference was again recently changed to one of COSC specs.--though the movement remains the same.

The current version has the four line dial typical of COSC models.

A Z series,

As for swapping the 5513.....depends on the individual. We're all different.

Congrats on a great watch.

Lol-x · 24 February 2008, 12:47 PM

A used 14060 is going for around $3,000-3,500.
A 5513 is going for around $5,000

It does depend on what you are are after. I would take the M just because it is the latest, but there isn't much difference, if any between the M & the Z.
As stated the one to get might well be the COSC model, as that is the latest, and it might well be the shortest produced non-date Sub, depending on what Rolex announces in April this year in the way of new/replacement models.

Scooby · 24 February 2008, 01:10 PM

Ah, I am now less confused. It is an F series 14060M. Got it.

Congrats again. Great watch.

mdx77 · 24 February 2008, 01:15 PM

Whew....glad we got that cleared up!

tvbunk · 24 February 2008, 04:38 PM

It is an F series 14060M. Got it. I understand now. However I am confused by the following statement....."The current version has the four line dial typical of COSC models." What is meant by four line dial and COSC.....BTW. my old 5513 I purchased in Hong Kong on R&R from Viet Nam for $90. It served me well over the years. I would give it a fair condition rating having hands changed and crystal changed along with crown and tube back in the 80's. I think the trade was a good one. I probably should have held out for a dated 16610 model.....oh well.... thank everyone for clairfying everything.

mike · 24 February 2008, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tvbunk

However I am confused by the following statement....."The current version has the four line dial typical of COSC models."

tv,... That was me. It's "collector's shorthand" for a dial written as such,

SUBMARINER
1000FT.=300M
Superlative Chronometer
Officially Certified

SPACE-DWELLER · 24 February 2008, 10:31 PM

Welcome to TRF!

Congrats on getting the Sub no date!

Please post a pic!

24 February 2008, 10:52 AM	#1
tvbunk "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Elk Grove, CA. Posts: 6	Z and M question from a new guy I have an F serial numbered Sub. It is a 14060 no date M series. What is the difference between the Z and the M series.....By the way I traded my old 5513 I got in Hong Kong in 1969 for it even up brand new in the box with papers....

24 February 2008, 12:34 PM	#5
Tools TRF Moderator & 2024 SubLV41 Patron Join Date: May 2007 Real Name: Larry Location: Mojave Desert Watch: GMT's Posts: 43,514	tv, Welcome to the Forum. If you have an "F" serial non-date Sub, then you have the 14060M reference. This model followed the 14060 after an upgrade in the movement and the M stands for "modified". A "Z" or an "M" Sub would be one with a serial number starting with those letters. They would all be 14060M's. As far as trading a 5513 for it, the fervor for vintage Subs are driving the value of excellent examples of those up and up.. The new 14060M gives you the modern equivalent of the old classic with Luminova markers, sapphire crystal, and a modern movement....This one should last you for another 40 years too. __________________ (Chill ... It's just a watch Forum.....) NAWCC Member

24 February 2008, 12:47 PM	#7
Lol-x Facilitator Join Date: Nov 2005 Real Name: Steve Location: Omnipresent Posts: 33,588	A used 14060 is going for around $3,000-3,500. A 5513 is going for around $5,000 It does depend on what you are are after. I would take the M just because it is the latest, but there isn't much difference, if any between the M & the Z. As stated the one to get might well be the COSC model, as that is the latest, and it might well be the shortest produced non-date Sub, depending on what Rolex announces in April this year in the way of new/replacement models. __________________ *Most folks are about as happy as they make up their minds to be.* ~Abraham Lincoln Nothing compares to the simple pleasure of a bike ride. ~John F. Kennedy ROLEXploitation - yeah I'm a victim

24 February 2008, 01:15 PM	#9
mdx77 "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Real Name: Kurt Location: Philly Burbs!! Posts: 3,296	Whew....glad we got that cleared up! __________________ “This is your last chance. After this, there is no turning back. You take the BLUE pill - the story ends; you wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the RED pill - you stay in Wonderland, and I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.” Rolex Submariner 116610LV Hulk \| Rolex GMT 16710 Pepsi \| Omega Speedmaster “Speedy Tuesday” \| Tudor Black Bay 79220R “ETA Rose” \| Tudor Pelagos Blue Dial \| Rolex Submariner Yellow Gold 116618LB \| Rolex Milgauss “Z-Blue” 116400GV

24 February 2008, 10:31 PM	#12
SPACE-DWELLER "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Real Name: Bo Location: Denmark Watch: Rolex, of course! Posts: 22,436	Welcome to TRF! Congrats on getting the Sub no date! Please post a pic! __________________ With kind regards, Bo LocTite 221: The Taming Of The Screw...

24 February 2008, 10:56 AM	#2
Scooby Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Real Name: Darren Location: Virginia, USA Watch: GMT Posts: 923	Not sure I follow. You have an F series sub but it as an M 14060? That's 2 different watches, no? Aside from that, I do not believe there is much difference between the Z and M seies, other than the newest 14060models are COSC certified (probably only the M's, but it could have started earlier, or later, meaning not all the M's). Also, what kind of condition was the 5513 in? Because if it was in good condition, there are alot of guys drooling for one of that vintage. Oh, congrats and welcome to the circus!

24 February 2008, 12:19 PM	#3
unclesallie 2024 ROLEX SUBMARINER 41 Pledge Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Real Name: dan Location: Pennsylvania Watch: keystone pocket Posts: 5,917	yeah, not sure i follow either. try this link:http://www.qualitytyme.net/pages/numbers.html when you go there, scroll down and you will see what we are talking about. best, dan

24 February 2008, 12:29 PM	#4
steel4me Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Real Name: SteelMan Location: Somewhere Posts: 719	I do not think they made 14060 in M series. However the complete designation of the 14060 is 14060M ..... for some reason the no date sub's model number is 14060M .... so having an F series 14060M is perefectly legit....but saying 14060M is 14060 M series is not correct ....

24 February 2008, 12:42 PM	#6
mike "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 22,683	I think I see what's going on here. I believe the poster is saying he has an F series 14060M. The 14060 replaced the 5513 circa 1989-90. Changes included a fast beat 3000 movement. About 2001 the reference was upgraded to the 14060M (for modified) indicating an upgrade in the movement to the current 3130. The reference was again recently changed to one of COSC specs.--though the movement remains the same. The current version has the four line dial typical of COSC models. A Z series, As for swapping the 5513.....depends on the individual. We're all different. Congrats on a great watch.

24 February 2008, 01:10 PM	#8
Scooby Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Real Name: Darren Location: Virginia, USA Watch: GMT Posts: 923	Ah, I am now less confused. It is an F series 14060M. Got it. Congrats again. Great watch.

24 February 2008, 04:38 PM	#10
tvbunk "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Elk Grove, CA. Posts: 6	It is an F series 14060M. Got it. I understand now. However I am confused by the following statement....."The current version has the four line dial typical of COSC models." What is meant by four line dial and COSC.....BTW. my old 5513 I purchased in Hong Kong on R&R from Viet Nam for $90. It served me well over the years. I would give it a fair condition rating having hands changed and crystal changed along with crown and tube back in the 80's. I think the trade was a good one. I probably should have held out for a dated 16610 model.....oh well.... thank everyone for clairfying everything.

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