Dial Damage on vintage Datejust--What's Happened Here?

[Nick9]

Hi, all.

Looking for some understanding about what's going on with the dial on this DJ. A friend of mine recently bought it, and he has asked me. It's not damage that I've seen before and so with his permission I'm posting it here for your thoughts.

It seems to me to have an odd texture, and as you can see, some of the dial printing is gone. Also the lume is green...all in all I'm a little baffled.

Thanks for your thoughts.

[swish77]

Looks like a blue linen (textured) dial that's been relumed, hence the green color. Presumably it glows.

The missing letters on the dial were perhaps the result of a botched attempt at some kind of cleaning or restoration, or just from a heavy-handed watchmaker during the re-lume.

The good news is that these old DJ dials are relatively easy to source, so I'd just try to find one to swap out. They pop up from time to time on the sales forum here and on VRF. You can also occasionally find good ones on eBay, although the blue linen ones might be more difficult to find.

Good luck!

[CTech]

This isn't a linen dial (no vertical threads visible), but it might be a Shantung dial or even one named by others as "bricks in the wall". Both are relatively uncommon, but the latter is extremely rare.

All we can see is that it might be a pie pan dial (or is that refraction from the edge of the crystal?) with a number of irregularities, so I think there is a very good possibility that this is an aftermarket dial and that is why it has aged differently from the genuine articles.

Removal of the dial and looking at the details of how it was made, how the indices were attached, etc. might reveal if it is aftermarket or if it is a refinished genuine one.

Regardless of what it is, swish's advice is good - throw it out and put a good one on the watch. DJ dials aren't hard to come by or particularly expensive, even pie pan ones, and your friend should be able to find some attractive dials from good sources with a little bit of work.

[miamiclay]

Originally Posted by CTech

This isn't a linen dial (no vertical threads visible), but it might be a Shantung dial or even one named by others as "bricks in the wall". Both are relatively uncommon, but the latter is extremely rare.

I thought shantung, brick, and mosaic were all terms referring to the same dials, as in THIS thread - No?

What’s the difference?

[CTech]

You could well be right and these are all different terms for the same type of dial, but with little to no definitive information to go on it is difficult to say.

Of the types we know:

Linen is a clear category -fabric type with horizontal and vertical threads.

Shantung and mosaic probably describe the same dial - similar to linen but with no vertical threads, no regular pattern.

The only reason I think there might be a third type, the "bricks in the wall", is from some dealer listings. Admittedly there is some hype and hyperbole, but the dealer photographs seem to show some short vertical lines making blocks or rectangles out of some of the horizontal lines.

The confusion about this is that a blue Shantung dial often has the same feature where discrete darker blue, white or silver colored thick lines can be seen, giving a vague brick like appearance in parts.

The only claimed "bricks in the wall" dials have been blue ones so it is possible they have been Shantung dials and have been wrongly described in order to claim false rarity and hence higher prices.

It's difficult to say if it really exists without seeing both dials in person, side by side, with good lighting and magnification.

Overall, I tend to think the "bricks in the wall" dial is really a Shantung dial with a higher than normal amount of dark blue lines visible, but who really knows? Until proven one way or another there is a possibility that there are linen, Shantung and a rare third type, currently called "bricks in the wall" by dealers.

[BigBlue1]

I would agree that this isn’t a fabric linen type dial. Definitely a re lume. The dial is common or at least I believe it to be as it seems a common one. I have no explanation as far as why the letters are missing. The dials can be relatively had for cheap so shouldn’t be a problem. Good luck.

[Nick9]

Some knowledge, some great advice and I have passed it along.

Thanks to all. Stay safe!

[Nick9]

Just to finish the story.

My friend decided to sell it as is. Listed it in a couple of places with a full description based on the feedback here, reasonable asking price, and it sold quickly.