Unresponsive/disengaged SA

[RealMadrid1988]

Been lusting after a RO for about 15 years, and about 3-4 years ago first registered my interest at a local boutique. During that time, the SA I first met with left, and I only found out about it maybe a year afterwards (there was a long period where appointments were required and sort of hard to come by, and no watches to view or try on — so basically no legitimate reason to visit).

I’ve recently tried to rekindle a relationship with the brand and been assigned a new SA, but he just seems to have no interest in dealing with me, despite a very friendly/positive initial interaction. In the time since we met several months back, I’ve sent probably 4 text messages, and 3 of the 4 have gone unanswered. The one time he did answer, I told him I’d swing by, he recommended a few windows, and when I did arrive he then suddenly had appointments and I left after about 30 minutes of just sitting there waiting.

Now, I totally get the fact that demand for ROs outstrips supply, and I don’t in any way think I’m entitled to a Royal Oak from the boutique. But it’s extremely frustrating (dare I say irritating) to essentially just be ghosted repeatedly by the SA.

Has anyone dealt with a similar experience, and if so, how did you handle/resolve it? I’m sure some people would advise me to just go grey, and that’s definitely something I’m strongly considering. But as someone who really likes the AP brand and wants to engage with it, experiences like this really turn me off.

[Akacoke]

While that's unacceptable for sure. But Id recommend you to call the store to make appointment or if your store allows it online do it online. If you don't like the current SA. Call the store speak to someone on the phone find out who else works there and try another SA with an appointment. These days Id never go to AP without an appointment. I always call or make appointment online and request the same person. SAs are just human. They are not gonna remember you most likely if you haven't shoped with them.
My SAs literally shows me he gets couple hundred texts each day from people doing asking similar things. He certainly have no time to answer your appointment request on his work phone. This is just the reality. Not saying it's your fault but this is the game we have to play to get a watch.

Your original SA leaving it's no big deal. I've been thru the same thing. As long as your profile looks good meaning notes in their system looks good then always someone will take care of you.
I hope this helps

[agsstructures]

Go gray, prices have tanked for AP. No point in playing these nonsense games

[Emery]

Code is always the answer.

If you just want one steel RO and you’re done, just go grey and save everyone the stress.

[7sins]

Change your SA and or work with the boutique manager to outline your experience and expectations. You will likely need to start with a ROO or Code to start your journey before being assigned a RO. If you have a friend or colleague who has an existing relationship with the boutique, an introduction from them will go a LONG way.

Your SA makes or breaks your AP experience.

[Akacoke]

Originally Posted by 7sins

Change your SA and or work with the boutique manager to outline your experience and expectations. You will likely need to start with a ROO or Code to start your journey before being assigned a RO. If you have a friend or colleague who has an existing relationship with the boutique, an introduction from them will go a LONG way.

Your SA makes or breaks your AP experience.

I've heard a lot of great things of the new AP house in socal.

[VogelPhoenix]

Originally Posted by RealMadrid1988

But as someone who really likes the AP brand and wants to engage with it

I get the irritation, but if "liking the AP brand" translates into asking for a RO/ROC, there's only so much the SA can do for a customer and the dozens like them with the same ask approaching each boutique every week. If you ask for a ROO or Code or a watch for the missus they make actually be able to help you, instead of just making friendly conversation (or not, in this case).

After one of the drops last year, I witnessed one SA getting text after text on their phone every few minutes during a half hour chat with me. I have gotten replies from "my" SA at 1-2AM in the morning, after they worked through the days list of inquiries, most of them asking for watches the store just doesn't have. Some will say, tough luck for them, that's their job, but strangely that doesn't seem the attitude of those around here with the most successful journeys. One wonders why

[mickyd329]

Originally Posted by Akacoke

I've heard a lot of great things of the new AP house in socal.

It's a great place. Friendly staff and great ambiance. You should visit the next time your in socal.

[mickyd329]

Originally Posted by VogelPhoenix

I get the irritation, but if "liking the AP brand" translates into asking for a RO/ROC, there's only so much the SA can do for a customer and the dozens like them with the same ask approaching each boutique every week. If you ask for a ROO or Code or a watch for the missus they make actually be able to help you, instead of just making friendly conversation (or not, in this case).

After one of the drops last year, I witnessed one SA getting text after text on their phone every few minutes during a half hour chat with me. I have gotten replies from "my" SA at 1-2AM in the morning, after they worked through the days list of inquiries, most of them asking for watches the store just doesn't have. Some will say, tough luck for them, that's their job, but strangely that doesn't seem the attitude of those around here with the most successful journeys. One wonders why

There is a lot of truth to this statement. After the new releases this month, my SA told me she got over 150 texts the day of and the day after alone.

[Octagon Guy]

Originally Posted by 7sins

Change your SA and or work with the boutique manager to outline your experience and expectations. You will likely need to start with a ROO or Code to start your journey before being assigned a RO. If you have a friend or colleague who has an existing relationship with the boutique, an introduction from them will go a LONG way.

Your SA makes or breaks your AP experience.

100% agree!

[Octagon Guy]

Originally Posted by RealMadrid1988

But as someone who really likes the AP brand and wants to engage with it

Liking the brand and liking RO is totally different. Liking the brand means you are willing to build your collection across all lines, not only RO.

A Rolex AD once told me "If people are only interested in our sports models and we have enough supply to cater to demand, we can retrench all our staffs and close shop. Vending machines to dispense sports models are more than sufficient then." Totally make sense to me.

Don't get it wrong, I'm in no position to put you down. Cos I'm also only interested in their CODE series and zero intention to buy a RO/ROO.

[codecow]

Here’s the obligatory “just buy gray” post.

3-4 YEARS? You could have been wearing whatever watch you actually want for that time.

[Ashj52]

I would definitely make an appointment and ask for a different SA. I was allocated a Royal Oak during the "hype" period as my first AP - I think it is doable if you check in regularly with your SA and they feel you are not a flipper.

[1William]

If you are not getting the watch you want from the Boutique and by allocation, you will never get the watch because of buy history you are not a customer, just a distraction. If you do not like it I am sure AP will make it without you. If you are willing to purchase other watches and build a history with the store and the brand then maybe, just maybe, the watch gods will bestow upon you the watch you really want. Stop wasting your time and the time of the Boutique to just go by and tire kick. Prices in the secondary market have softened and if you take into account having to buy models you do not want and will lose money selling or trading afterwards the Secondary market looks great. This is the reality of the situation. Good luck and remember it is all about the watches.

[4reRlxGuy]

Off topic but related.

Any insight to what sort of commission a SA makes on each piece? For those of us on the early stage of the "journey" maybe the pieces we're buying don't generate much commission like a precious metal complication piece likely does.

[RealMadrid1988]

Thanks all for the responses! I'll try to set up an appointment with another SA and see if things look any better. It's a bit awkward because I'm sure they'll ask for a reason for switching SAs and my goal isn't to "bad mouth" the current SA, but even just politely and honestly explaining the situation will probably reflect poorly on the SA even if that isn't my intention. And if switching SAs doesn't seem to be going anywhere, I'll just go grey.

Originally Posted by VogelPhoenix

I get the irritation, but if "liking the AP brand" translates into asking for a RO/ROC, there's only so much the SA can do for a customer and the dozens like them with the same ask approaching each boutique every week. If you ask for a ROO or Code or a watch for the missus they make actually be able to help you, instead of just making friendly conversation (or not, in this case).

After one of the drops last year, I witnessed one SA getting text after text on their phone every few minutes during a half hour chat with me. I have gotten replies from "my" SA at 1-2AM in the morning, after they worked through the days list of inquiries, most of them asking for watches the store just doesn't have. Some will say, tough luck for them, that's their job, but strangely that doesn't seem the attitude of those around here with the most successful journeys. One wonders why

"Liking the AP brand" means I was first drawn in by the Royal Oak and have, over time, grown to appreciate the ROO and Code lines (and the previous ReMaster line) and have said as much to the SAs. But it's the RO that first drew me in, and it's the watch I most want at the present time.

To be clear, I don't begrudge an SA for sometimes not responding to text messages if they're getting a ton. (I'm not sure that's the case here given what I know about the SA, but that's beside the point.) But when I go out of my way to visit the store at the time he suggests only for him to be "too busy to see me," I guess I would've expected he'd at least spend 30 seconds in between guests to come say hello, politely apologize for not being able to see me during that time and offer to schedule an appointment for a future date? Instead I just sat there waiting and left after 30 minutes because I wasn't going to waste my afternoon hoping for his time.

Look, I get the SAs are busy, but if the reality is that SAs are just ignoring dozens/hundreds of potential customers (which seems to be what some are suggesting), then maybe AP needs a better way of corresponding with potential customers. I've liked the brand before it was hyped up and will like it after the hype dies -- but being ignored doesn't make me want to engage with the brand going forward.

[squall1]

Did you have a set appointment? Like a confirmed, specific time? It's not clear from your post and sounds like he gave you some options and you just maybe showed up to one of them without confirmation? If that's the case then I sort of understand.

One thing, right or wrong, is that they definitely skew their time towards existing clients. I appreciate this. If I have an appointment I don't want that time being interrupted by a walk in or some looky loo interrupting a watch delivery. I appreciate the time and the undivided attention. I also appreciate that might frustrate some.

Also, as alluded to above, they are after clients who will be long term customers across the range. If someone comes in emphasizing RO, they will prioritize other clients.

Good luck with your new SA. My advice is to set a specific appointment and start the conversation about the brand at large. Don't be offended if they they ask personal questions about you, your background, watch collecting, or hobbies. Some complain about this, but it is what it is and not a big deal imo.

[Ichiran]

Just be patient. I waited 7 years for my first AP (26715 blue). You are merely halfway there...

[NYG1121]

Been there, done that. Not worth the effort for me anymore

[Fleetlord]

It's too late. SA have many many established clients to cater to. These clients buy and buy and buy. The SA simply don't have the bandwidth to deal with unestablished buyers who are only after the hawt references that everybody wants...

[IS2000]

Been through the same thing with my local AP house. I gave up and just went for other watch brands instead.

[AK797]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

It's too late. SA have many many established clients to cater to. These clients buy and buy and buy. The SA simply don't have the bandwidth to deal with unestablished buyers who are only after the hawt references that everybody wants...

I agree, same for Rolex and PP, they have a list of clients they have to please first, unless you can charm them and build a fantastic rapport with one of them, honestly its like being back in high school and you have to get past the superstar MVP jocks to get to the Prom Queen, it can be done but you're going to have to plan and write this script like its a movie blockbuster.

[abrosz]

Similar experience here as the OP. Been inquiring with various boutiques for 4 years now. Interested in several pieces. Steered repeatedly to things I don't want and didn't ask about. Nothing but games and BS. These sales associates literally have more clients than they can possibly keep straight and have ZERO power to actually allocate you anything. You're negotiating with a manager you've never met and who doesn't know you. Hence the, "I'm going to advocate on your behalf," game. My SA in NYC has been with the brand for six years and has only seen a Royal Oak go to a new client twice.

On top of that, the brand makes too few watches to meet demand. I had an hour-long conversation with Natalie, the manager at the NYC flagship boutique a week ago. She quite literally has no idea what Le Brassus is going to send her or when. The watches just show up and she allocates them. New clients have ZERO chance at anything Royal Oak given the current demand from existing clients. Buying a Code or Offshore DOES NOT in any way guarantee a Royal Oak allocation. You could be out $50K on something you're not interested in. Read about the guy who spent $400K in Las Vegas on things he didn't want.

Bottom line is that demand far outstrips supply. The sales associates are trained to lead you on indefinitely on promises that you'll get something. Just go gray. Codes are well under retail, and you can find previous Royal Oak models preowned at relatively good prices. All you need to service and register is the online account, which you don't even need a sales associate for. If the brand doesn't have what you want to buy, can't obtain what you want to buy, can't order what you want to buy, can't tell you when it might have what you want to buy, and then refuses to allocate to you what you want to buy, how can you possibly purchase it as a new client.

[dauster]

Originally Posted by abrosz

Similar experience here as the OP. Been inquiring with various boutiques for 4 years now. Interested in several pieces. Steered repeatedly to things I don't want and didn't ask about. Nothing but games and BS. These sales associates literally have more clients than they can possibly keep straight and have ZERO power to actually allocate you anything. You're negotiating with a manager you've never met and who doesn't know you. Hence the, "I'm going to advocate on your behalf," game. My SA in NYC has been with the brand for six years and has only seen a Royal Oak go to a new client twice.

On top of that, the brand makes too few watches to meet demand. I had an hour-long conversation with Natalie, the manager at the NYC flagship boutique a week ago. She quite literally has no idea what Le Brassus is going to send her or when. The watches just show up and she allocates them. New clients have ZERO chance at anything Royal Oak given the current demand from existing clients. Buying a Code or Offshore DOES NOT in any way guarantee a Royal Oak allocation. You could be out $50K on something you're not interested in. Read about the guy who spent $400K in Las Vegas on things he didn't want.

Bottom line is that demand far outstrips supply. The sales associates are trained to lead you on indefinitely on promises that you'll get something. Just go gray. Codes are well under retail, and you can find previous Royal Oak models preowned at relatively good prices. All you need to service and register is the online account, which you don't even need a sales associate for. If the brand doesn't have what you want to buy, can't obtain what you want to buy, can't order what you want to buy, can't tell you when it might have what you want to buy, and then refuses to allocate to you what you want to buy, how can you possibly purchase it as a new client.

mods please pin this amazing post / statement at the top of the AP discussion board - mic drop enough said

[WatchEater666]

Originally Posted by codecow

Here’s the obligatory “just buy gray” post.

3-4 YEARS? You could have been wearing whatever watch you actually want for that time.

APs are mass market watches, the co does billions in revenue. It's not like you're buying some hard to find rare art piece that is handcrafted by the finest artisans known to man. There's no point in waiting!

Just go grey...most ROs trade around retail now and are getting cheaper by the month.

Don't let some sales associate step treat you poorly.

[mickyd329]

It's an unfortunate reality. Not enough supply for the demand for RO's. Even though secondary prices have come way down, the demand at the boutiques seem to still be robust.

I agree with others. These SA's have to dedicate so much time to take care of their existing clients that they probably don't have enough time nor the allocations to help new ones.

I do disagree somewhat with first purchase RO's. They do happen, albeit not often enough. It all depends on the SA. From my experience, the boutiques do have some visibility before inventory comes in. They don't just show up without the boutique knowing.

[abrosz]

Originally Posted by mickyd329

It's an unfortunate reality. Not enough supply for the demand for RO's. Even though secondary prices have come way down, the demand at the boutiques seem to still be robust.

I agree with others. These SA's have to dedicate so much time to take care of their existing clients that they probably don't have enough time nor the allocations to help new ones.

I do disagree somewhat with first purchase RO's. They do happen, albeit not often enough. It all depends on the SA. From my experience, the boutiques do have some visibility before inventory comes in. They don't just show up without the boutique knowing.

New buyers should be wary of this brand. I played similar games with a Patek dealer who nearly defrauded me out of $72,000 over a 5726a with the proposition of “buy a calatrava every year” for consideration. Had to threaten a very public lawsuit and sign an NDA to get my money back. If you want a Royal Oak, save up a bit more and go gray and buy what you want when you want. Want a Code? Go gray and buy at discount. Open an AP web account and register it and seevice it with the brand. You can even call the APNA client care number in Florida with a serial number and they’ll cross reference the number with the description of the watch before you purchase.

[7sins]

Originally Posted by mickyd329

It's an unfortunate reality. Not enough supply for the demand for RO's. Even though secondary prices have come way down, the demand at the boutiques seem to still be robust.

I agree with others. These SA's have to dedicate so much time to take care of their existing clients that they probably don't have enough time nor the allocations to help new ones.

I do disagree somewhat with first purchase RO's. They do happen, albeit not often enough. It all depends on the SA. From my experience, the boutiques do have some visibility before inventory comes in. They don't just show up without the boutique knowing.

Agreed, I know several individuals (5+) who received a RO for their first watch, including a green 15510st and had no connection at AP. They were persistent, showed they were a WIS and are exceptional at building relationships. All of this in SoCal boutiques that have overwhelming demand from new clients.

[abrosz]

Originally Posted by 7sins

Agreed, I know several individuals (5+) who received a RO for their first watch, including a green 15510st and had no connection at AP. They were persistent, showed they were a WIS and are exceptional at building relationships. All of this in SoCal boutiques that have overwhelming demand from new clients.

I have no vested interest in making up details of my conversation with Natalie at NYC. She is the one who allocates the pieces at her boutique. New clients aren't allocated Royal Oaks, particularly those with blue or green dials. You want a RO, gray was the only possibility, and even then no guarantee on timing or delivery.

My NYC sales rep, the one with whom I have to maintain a relationship but has no knowledge of what the brand has to sell, when it has it to sell, or power to allocate me anything, told me that he has 1000s to 10000s clients. In the six years he's been working for the brand, he's seen two of his new clients get allocated a Royal Oak. Any Royal Oak.

I don't doubt your 5 people who've been allocated a Royal Oak. I submit they are the extremely rare and luck exception rather than the rule. The brand and its boutiques have been VERY consistent in my inquiries. Code, Code, Code first. Natalie just said the silent part out loud. New clients don't get Royal Oaks.

[VogelPhoenix]

The basic math is straightforward - the average boutique gets 500 watches per year (50k divided by 100 outlets). Out of those, about 15-20 will be Jumbos and with a larger uncertainty maybe 100 will be other basic men’s size ROs. They could certainly sell a year’s worth of Jumbos every day or two and their annual RO allocation in a week or two, all to new clients.

In 2022 there was the missive to sell 30% of watches to new clients (leading to a surge of 50th anniversary pieces being flipped). Even if that still stood and extended to Jumbos, that’s 5 watches for 1000s of inquiries. So it may happen with some low likelihood, but even then it’s not random, but with preference for clients with a very strong referral or very high prospective value (where actions, i.e., buying something other than what everybody else is asking for, speak infinitely louder than words).


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