Did I miss the Blueberry Memo

[AJMarcus]

Originally Posted by 1675-David

Blueberry inserts were discussed to death a few months ago and a conclusion of sorts was reached in the community that the blueberry insert was not a authentic Rolex part, have I missed a plot twist, as I see them reapearing in the market in the last week, one on Instagram and one from HQ Milton, both for a premium

I thinks its a 50-50 split on whether Blueberry existed as an insert. Some believe Rolex issued it as a replacement insert on GMTs.

[Royale With Cheese]

Whats interesting about this point is that as far as I understand, Rolex has neither confirmed nor denied the authenticity of a Blueberry insert. They have remained totally mute on the topic.

The controversy has been that quite a few individuals have taken their silence in the matter as an indication that the inserts are not authentic.. but it seems entirely speculative.

Frankly, I believe the way Rolex conducted production and replacement parts was much messier than it is today. They probably don't even have a clear indication themselves whether these came from their factory or not. Now, as they've seen the collectability of vintage watches reach unfathomable levels in recent years, they probably felt the best approach in such a case is to remain silent..

At least where HQ Milton is concerned, it seems they believe the inserts to be authentic. Jacek at one point had posted on his Instagram highlighting the details of a genuine blueberry insert - how there is a 'ghost' triangle silhouette within the marker at 12:00. I found that quite interesting.

It's still hard to say which way this goes without a firm statement from Rolex, but I wouldn't put it past them to have experimented with an insert like this in small batches. To me its entirely plausible...

(sorry for the rant)

[Pocosso]

Guys,
did a blueberry ever been sold at one of the Famous Auction Houses?
I never seen one at Phillip's or any other famous Houses, does it means they are not thrusting on those?

[roh123]

Originally Posted by Pocosso

Guys,
did a blueberry ever been sold at one of the Famous Auction Houses?
I never seen one at Phillip's or any other famous Houses, does it means they are not thrusting on those?

They’ve all sold them.

https://www.christies.com/lotfinder/...8-details.aspx
https://www.phillips.com/detail/rolex/HK080117/1103A

[Pocosso]

Thanks,
This should be enough to feed the collectors then, don't you think?

[gsg]

Originally Posted by BigBlue1

Maybe until it’s proven one way or the other these blueberry threads should be banned till there is conclusive evidence of their authenticity. I must admit there was a time when I wanted one as they are unique and are visually striking . Then as time went on and I educated myself I found more questions then answers surrounding their authenticity. Every time one of these blueberry threads pop up they usually bring negative attention, inconclusive evidence or Sometimes get shut down by Peter

Why would you ban healthy discussions on a matter of such importance to vintage collectors? I have found all conversations about these blueberry inserts, present and past, very enlightening and educational. Posts like these help collectors better assess the risk they are taking when considering one of these bezels. Inflated valuations have turned the vintage market into a minefield and it is now more than ever that knowledge and expertise needs to be shared.

[Sublovin]

Originally Posted by swaini3

Some people believe their authentic, some dont. Maybe HQ believe they're real. Why the harsh comments

In my opinion, a reputable watch seller should only be selling items that they know to be authentic. With something like this, it is up to the dealer to prove authenticity, not up to the consumer to prove it isn’t. We aren’t talking about an archaeological dig that turns up something from millions of years ago. Don’t we all think that if these were ever released by Rolex there would be a record of it, or that the company could definitively confirm?
My thoughts.

[twnturbo]

QUOTE/
Jacek at one point had posted on his Instagram highlighting the details of a genuine blueberry insert - how there is a 'ghost' triangle silhouette within the marker at 12:00. I found that quite interesting.



(sorry for the rant)[/QUOTE]

I've never heard of this are there any pics ?

[Kingface66]

Originally Posted by twnturbo

QUOTE/
Jacek at one point had posted on his Instagram highlighting the details of a genuine blueberry insert - how there is a 'ghost' triangle silhouette within the marker at 12:00. I found that quite interesting.



(sorry for the rant)

I've never heard of this are there any pics ?[/QUOTE]

Here ya go. And here’s the link to the Instagram page
https://www.instagram.com/p/B0gtn2ml...=1phrus0ipd2px

[springer]

Besides the shadow in the triangle found on the blueberry, look for the dimple on the back. If anyone takes the time to read this complete thread, and buried inside of some of the sub threads, I've posted pics of these insert dimples found on "genuine" inserts besides the blueberry.

As always, buyers need to be aware of all the facts before making any purchase decisions.

Below - some dimple pics found on the back of non blueberry and blueberry bezel inserts along with two close-ups of the blueberry 12 o'clock triangle depicting the shadow effect inside the triangle.

[roh123]

These characteristics are just what’s been seen on some. I doubt Jacek or anyone else knows if they are real to begin with. We know that a batch surfaced in Florida about 20y ago (1999?) where John Buckley and Arthur (AAKVIPER) bought them and from there they have been spread around. No one actually knows if they are real or not as they bought them from a third party. Not Rolex. Before this they aren’t documented or even seen in auction catalogues or advertisements.

Beside these it is highly likely others have popped up around the world. Real or fake? No one knows. We don’t know more today than we knew in the early 2000’s.

Each to their own on this topic until something more substantial pops up.

[powerfunk]

Here are the facts as I understand them:

1. Nobody has papers of a new "Blueberry" being sold new, a Rolex service center affirmed that the 1675 never came with a blue insert, and nobody even seems to claim having seen one before 2000.

2. Very authentic-seeming blueberry inserts do exist, so the quality alone doesn't mean they're authentic. Jedly1 once took a blueberry insert (that looked good enough to him to think it might be authentic) to an RSC who confirmed that particular insert was not original, though they didn't comment on blueberries as a whole.

3. Nobody has ever seen a service receipt or a clamshell Rolex parts case for a bluebery insert. This to me is quite damning. 1 Blueberry without any provenance? Sure, I guess the service receipt got lost (and we're not talking about something from the 1960's here; the theory is that they were a service part from 2000 or so). Sure, receipts get lost. But there have been what, 100 Blueberries sold at this point? Nicely evenly spaced over time and among various sellers, conveniently. And not a single one of these has the clamshell case with the parts number? Or the RSC receipt saying "blue insert?" It just seems mathematically implausible to me. I know where Occam's Razor falls on this issue for me.

[Micha]

Originally Posted by 1665fan

Did you think the dealers were just going to throw there blueberrys away lol....no wait till the fake posts die down and try to find a sucker.....the dealer way!!!

x2

[Dan S]

As long as people are still drinking the Kool-aid, they will continue to have value. And based on these threads, there are plenty of people out here who are willing to suspend their disbelief ("nobody has proven they are fake"). Rolex will never make a definitive statement, so the Greater Fool Theory applies, and dealers will continue to flip them.

[Nikrnic]

I think the jigs up on that not being a factory authentic offering as there was never any proof of it being so. Nice change as an extra bezel but I can't understand why there would be a premium as it seems like the Blueberry is only a fantasy without documentation.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by powerfunk

Here are the facts as I understand them:

1. Nobody has papers of a new "Blueberry" being sold new, a Rolex service center affirmed that the 1675 never came with a blue insert, and nobody even seems to claim having seen one before 2000.

2. Very authentic-seeming blueberry inserts do exist, so the quality alone doesn't mean they're authentic. Jedly1 once took a blueberry insert (that looked good enough to him to think it might be authentic) to an RSC who confirmed that particular insert was not original, though they didn't comment on blueberries as a whole.

3. Nobody has ever seen a service receipt or a clamshell Rolex parts case for a bluebery insert. This to me is quite damning. 1 Blueberry without any provenance? Sure, I guess the service receipt got lost (and we're not talking about something from the 1960's here; the theory is that they were a service part from 2000 or so). Sure, receipts get lost. But there have been what, 100 Blueberries sold at this point? Nicely evenly spaced over time and among various sellers, conveniently. And not a single one of these has the clamshell case with the parts number? Or the RSC receipt saying "blue insert?" It just seems mathematically implausible to me. I know where Occam's Razor falls on this issue for me.

Interesting information Rob, thank you

[GB-man]

All I know is that one crazy guy on IG was hellbent on proving them fake. I had to unfollow him because he posted about it like 10 times a day and kept referring to himself in third person.

[TimeLord2]

Originally Posted by GB-man

All I know is that one crazy guy on IG was hellbent on proving them fake. I had to unfollow him because he posted about it like 10 times a day and kept referring to himself in third person.

Haahhahahaahaha! That's all I have to add…

[Royale With Cheese]

Originally Posted by GB-man

All I know is that one crazy guy on IG was hellbent on proving them fake. I had to unfollow him because he posted about it like 10 times a day and kept referring to himself in third person.

Do you have a link to his account? Or his username?

Would be interested to have a read on his theories

[Dan S]

Originally Posted by Royale With Cheese

Do you have a link to his account? Or his username?

Would be interested to have a read on his theories

He must be talking about Orchi.

[GB-man]

Originally Posted by Dan S

He must be talking about Orchi.

Yeah that’s him. Refers to himself in third person as O all the time lol

His commentary was relevant and interesting but if you talk about it all day for months it gets tiring.

[Greglaw]

This could be settled if someone had theirs serviced and Rolex left the bezel insert...any volunteers?

[roh123]

Originally Posted by Greglaw

This could be settled if someone had theirs serviced and Rolex left the bezel insert...any volunteers?

Jed already did that with one and John Buckley and Arthur did it with another. Different outcomes.

These are what they are. Some like them. Some don’t. I doubt anyone with come to a conclusion and they will remain pricey.

[suligeo]

Originally Posted by Greglaw

This could be settled if someone had theirs serviced and Rolex left the bezel insert...any volunteers?

Even than I don’t believe it.


https://www.instagram.com/vintage_georgex/

[Swearengen]

It's a stretch to believe the blueberry insert first appears in 2000 for a watch that went out of production in 1980. Buddy O my be onto something

[roh123]

Originally Posted by Swearengen

It's a stretch to believe the blueberry insert first appears in 2000 for a watch that went out of production in 1980. Buddy O my be onto something

It’s not a new discussion. They have been debated since they came on to the market.

[T*M*M]

I’m not sure why Ive seen no chatter anywhere in the internet about this, but….at the W&W booth this year Rolex had every GMT bezel ever made on display….there wasn’t a blueberry. Case
Closed?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[MrBlobby]

Every type of gmt bezel on display? Are there any photos?

[scooba]

Originally Posted by powerfunk

Here are the facts as I understand them:

1. Nobody has papers of a new "Blueberry" being sold new, a Rolex service center affirmed that the 1675 never came with a blue insert, and nobody even seems to claim having seen one before 2000.

2. Very authentic-seeming blueberry inserts do exist, so the quality alone doesn't mean they're authentic. Jedly1 once took a blueberry insert (that looked good enough to him to think it might be authentic) to an RSC who confirmed that particular insert was not original, though they didn't comment on blueberries as a whole.

3. Nobody has ever seen a service receipt or a clamshell Rolex parts case for a bluebery insert. This to me is quite damning. 1 Blueberry without any provenance? Sure, I guess the service receipt got lost (and we're not talking about something from the 1960's here; the theory is that they were a service part from 2000 or so). Sure, receipts get lost. But there have been what, 100 Blueberries sold at this point? Nicely evenly spaced over time and among various sellers, conveniently. And not a single one of these has the clamshell case with the parts number? Or the RSC receipt saying "blue insert?" It just seems mathematically implausible to me. I know where Occam's Razor falls on this issue for me.

I am with you 100% , Also Xeramic over on VintageRolex Forums provided a really detailed explanation as to why they should be viewed with caution