Check out my ~40yr GMT 1675 after complete rehaul

[RLXGMT-1675]

Hi guys,

I'm very much new to this forum. I'm also new to owning Rolex and even newer at photographing Rolex!

My father recently gave me his vintage 1965 GMT-Master.
Details are as follows:
Case ref: 1675
Caliber 1575GMT (non-quickset)
Case serial: 1820XXX
Dial: Matte Black
Bracelet: 93150 with 580 end-pieces (a sub bracelet)
Prior service date: sometime in June 1987(!)

After 20 years without a service, merely washing my hands wearing it resulted in immediate water ingress. Not wasting a minute I took it to the RSC and requested:

New dial (the old tritium dial had lost its luminosity)
New hands (same as above)
New bezel insert
New acrylic crystal
Full movement service and calibration
Bracelet and case refinish
____________________________
Grand total: Euro 515 (~692.754 USD)

I know, I know, damn expensive but I live in Europe so everything is more expensive here!

Take a look at the pictures too:










I must say, photographing a watch is MUCH more difficult than it seems. After having taken about 80 images, only the 4 shown are actually any good. Either my camera sucks or I do.
On the same note, I noticed that using the flash on close-ups reveals little scratches and even dust(!) which really spoils the pic.

Guys, tell me what you think about this marvellous 40yr old watch.
I am only 23!

[C.J.]

That's a damn fine watch with a lot of sentiment behind it Congratulations and welcome to TRF

[mike]

Congrats on a lovely and 100% functional 1675. Heirlooms are always the most special as the sentamental value of these pieces are priceless.
Do take the time to learn all the stories you can as to what this watch has seen over the years and always cherish the memories!
The photos are fantastic! Well done!!

[JJ Irani]

Congrats on a great watch and welcome to TRF.

With Rolex you might try approaching it at an angle with your camera. The crystals do tend to bounce light.

JJ

[Dan Pierce]

A freakin great looking watch! I agree with Mike, I would ask your dad if there are any interesting stories about the GMT after all those years. AND WRITE THEM DOWN for your son to enjoy when he takes ownership of that beautiful Swiss timepiece.
dP

[Dan Pierce]

Oh, forgot, nice photos too.
dP

[RLXGMT-1675]

thanks for all your kind words everybody.

I have a couple of questions and I'm wondering if anybody knows the answers:
1) To what depth is this watch water resistant to?
2) There is a slight rattle caused by non SEL bracelet. Is it possible to fit an SEL bracelet on older GMT-Masters?
3) Did Rolex use 904L steel on vintage watches or 316L?

I'm just very curious to find out as much as I can about the technology behind such fine timepieces.
Couple that with a few great stories for which I'll be asking my dad soon and I've got a lot more than just a watch on my wrist every day!

[mike]

Originally Posted by RLXGMT-1675

thanks for all your kind words everybody.

I have a couple of questions and I'm wondering if anybody knows the answers:
1) To what depth is this watch water resistant to?
2) There is a slight rattle caused by non SEL bracelet. Is it possible to fit an SEL bracelet on older GMT-Masters?

Thanks for your responses.

1. 50 meters
2. the rattle is normal, all non-sels will do that to one extent or another.
I don't think you can on that reference.

[KJacques]

That is a great looking watch, which will mean so much to you in the years to come. I have an old vintage that I'm waiting to come back from service that I mostly took for granted. Seeing those pictures gives me an appreciation of vintage Rolex so I'm looking forward to getting mine back now.

Kevin

[mikey]

Excellent

[coltex]

Beautiful vintage timepiece, worth every cent in servicing!

[mailman]

Welcome to TRF What an entrance. That's a beautiful watch and something to cherish for a lifetime.

[Flyjet601]

Whoaaaa!

Gorgeous....

Take care of that baby

[problmchylde]

Don't care what the hardcore/purist vintage collectors say....i think the new luminova replacement dials look FANTASTIC Beautiful watch indeed

[yongkim]

Beautiful timepiece. I too took a ton of pics of my watch and less than 1% were suitable for posting. It is tougher than it looks to take nice pics. Awesome history behind the watch I'm sure. I just got my rollie and plan on giving it to my son when he reaches the right age. Congrats!

[Solo118]

Looks amazing, Like it was bought just yesterday

[Earl]

RLXGMT, Congratulations and wear in with pride :o)

[khergert]

You did not overspend in your rehab. I spent more with an independent guy I've delt with for over 20 years. I finally allowed them to redo the spider webbed dial, now line 2 says OYSTER PERPETUAL DATE. When I ask about it, they argue how the 3 words are right. Spent more, got less, I only go to the Rolex Repair Center for all work now.

[mike]

Originally Posted by RLXGMT-1675

thanks for all your kind words everybody.

I have a couple of questions and I'm wondering if anybody knows the answers:
1) To what depth is this watch water resistant to?
2) There is a slight rattle caused by non SEL bracelet. Is it possible to fit an SEL bracelet on older GMT-Masters?
3) Did Rolex use 904L steel on vintage watches or 316L?

I'm just very curious to find out as much as I can about the technology behind such fine timepieces.
Couple that with a few great stories for which I'll be asking my dad soon and I've got a lot more than just a watch on my wrist every day!

OK, (I swear I didn't see #3 the first time --I love those senior moments! )

Your GMT-Master uses 316L. 904 did not make it's debut untill the reference 168000 circa 1988-89.
I belive you mentioned the watch carried a 1.8 mil. ser.no. It should have the 1575 slow beat movement (19,800bph)
Of course non-hacking, non-quick-set. Since it's a 1675 the "stack" of the hands will be as follows:
24 hr., 12hr. minute, second.

1675,


This is different than the "newer" 16750 which introduced the quick-set feature to the GMT line which puts the 12 hr. hand on the bottom then the 24 hr. minute and second

16750 (WG surrounds)


Earlier 16750 matt,


While the dials appear similiar, they are NOT interchangable due to different placement of the dial feet to accomodate the newer fast beat movement of the 16750.

Orginally introduced circa 1960, the GMT-MASTER reference 1675 was the only sport model to have been sold with a jubilee bracelet option. (early 70s)
additionally, while first introduced with the classic Red/Blue insert, the 1675 was the first GMT to sport an all black insert.

The GMT has a long an storied history, being a favored watch of Military and Police during the 60s and 70s. Many say the GMT was the favored watch of the orginal NASA astronauts. While the GMT never landed on the moon, it's well documented that Col. Jack Swigert wore one on Apollo 13. That watch now rests in the Rolex museum with an inscription from the Col. saying "Thank you for getting me there on time"
http://www.secondtimeround.biz/histo...mt_master.html

The 1675 was the first watch I ever bought. I still have it and while I've been fortunate enough to have added a couple more nice pieces over the years, it's my most cherished piece!

[RLXGMT-1675]

Originally Posted by mike

OK, (I swear I didn't see #3 the first time --I love those senior moments! )

Your GMT-Master uses 316L. 904 did not make it's debut untill the reference 168000 circa 1988-89.
I belive you mentioned the watch carried a 1.8 mil. ser.no. It should have the 1575 slow beat movement (19,800bph)
Of course non-hacking, non-quick-set. Since it's a 1675 the "stack" of the hands will be as follows:
24 hr., 12hr. minute, second.

Mike,

Its my fault, kinda. I edited my original post after you replied to it which is why you missed my 3rd point.

Take a look at this pic:


On this pic we see the caseback of a 1970 GMT 1675. It shows clear signs of pitting/rust/corrosion. Now admittedly some watches are better taken care of than others.

I am aware that 904L steel is pretty much an example of Rolex overdesigning their watches "Because we can".

Are you aware of, say, your own watch having such corrosion issues? I was pretty much under the impression SS doesn't corrode when not exposed to sour/sulphide/hydrogen sulphate environments.

And a question for anyone who has dabbled in vintage watches, regardless of brand.
How long does a mechanical watch last?

Mine is certainly in great shape but do you guys reckon my swiss timepiece can actually last, say, another 40 yrs. That would be a grand total of 80yrs.

Frankly, I'm quite surprised Rolex achieved all this back in the 60's without the aid of CAD and immensely fast personal computers!

Just imagine how spectacular their modern watches are if their 40yr old models are this good!

[RLXGMT-1675]

Originally Posted by khergert

You did not overspend in your rehab. I spent more with an independent guy I've delt with for over 20 years. I finally allowed them to redo the spider webbed dial, now line 2 says OYSTER PERPETUAL DATE. When I ask about it, they argue how the 3 words are right. Spent more, got less, I only go to the Rolex Repair Center for all work now.

You're quite right. Who knows what kinds of things go on behind the scenes at non-official SCs. They certainly don't have the legendary Rolex name to uphold when they get on with their day to day business.

That's not to say thet there are no honest people in this business but frankly, even hearing that some unscrupulous watch tecnicians/repairmen will go to the trouble of e.g. converting SS DJs into TT DJs by adding original+non-original aftermarket spare parts is enough to put me off them for good.

You pay a bit more but in the end you get more. It seems that is very much a fact of life.

[mike]

Originally Posted by RLXGMT-1675

Mike,

Its my fault, kinda. I edited my original post after you replied to it which is why you missed my 3rd point.

Take a look at this pic:


On this pic we see the caseback of a 1970 GMT 1675. It shows clear signs of pitting/rust/corrosion. Now admittedly some watches are better taken care of than others.

I am aware that 904L steel is pretty much an example of Rolex overdesigning their watches "Because we can".

Are you aware of, say, your own watch having such corrosion issues? I was pretty much under the impression SS doesn't corrode when not exposed to sour/sulphide/hydrogen sulphate environments.

And a question for anyone who has dabbled in vintage watches, regardless of brand.
How long does a mechanical watch last?

Mine is certainly in great shape but do you guys reckon my swiss timepiece can actually last, say, another 40 yrs. That would be a grand total of 80yrs.

Frankly, I'm quite surprised Rolex achieved all this back in the 60's without the aid of CAD and immensely fast personal computers!

Just imagine how spectacular their modern watches are if their 40yr old models are this good!

Yeah, I've seen corrosion like that before. I've been pretty picky with the pieces I've selected if bought pre-owned. Pitting and corrosion are two things I look for (among other things).
My experience is that this comes from a lack of care and maintance. Many of these fine timepieces were certainly used in the manner in which they were designed, but I constantly read reports and posts of " I haven't serviced my watch in X number of years". Any steel, whether 316, 904, or some other type WILL show signs of pitting and corrosion if some program of maintanceis not followed.
Witness the corrosion and pitting problems Rolex had with hand sets of 50s 60s 70s and some 80s vintage pieces (not to mention the dial) that can be traced to little or no maintance--servicing, changing gaskets, crystals, etc... allowing moisture to enter the timepiece.

It's my belief that with proper maintance and correct parts there's no practical limit to the life span of a vintage piece. I'm aware of some VERY serious collectors with pieces approaching 80 and 90 years of age that are not only worn on a regular basis but keep time within chronometer specs.

The oldest piece in my stable is a GMT gilt dial bearing a 1.3 mil number. This watch is accurate to within LESS than +1 sec. a day. It has been used, but cared for, and still has it's orginal dial and hands,


Close up of dial.


I know the modern 3xxx fast beat movements are tough accurate movements, but I'm of the camp that just feels the 15xx movements were over engineered monsters that just absorbed tremendous punishment and never looked back.
Watchmakers whom I respect feel the the human engineering that went into these movements simply put them in a different league. I'm not a watchmaker, but I know from years of real world experience these are unbeliveable movements.
My most accurate watch is this "old sub" that saw the bad side of Vietnam. It runs at +/- 0 deviation.

[mikey]

My watch is a product of the SS to TT conversion and I love it. Paying more for the same thing makes no sense!

[RLXGMT-1675]

Originally Posted by mike

Yeah, I've seen corrosion like that before. I've been pretty picky with the pieces I've selected if bought pre-owned. Pitting and corrosion are two things I look for (among other things).
My experience is that this comes from a lack of care and maintance. Many of these fine timepieces were certainly used in the manner in which they were designed, but I constantly read reports and posts of " I haven't serviced my watch in X number of years". Any steel, whether 316, 904, or some other type WILL show signs of pitting and corrosion if some program of maintanceis not followed.
Witness the corrosion and pitting problems Rolex had with hand sets of 50s 60s 70s and some 80s vintage pieces (not to mention the dial) that can be traced to little or no maintance--servicing, changing gaskets, crystals, etc... allowing moisture to enter the timepiece.

It's my belief that with proper maintance and correct parts there's no practical limit to the life span of a vintage piece. I'm aware of some VERY serious collectors with pieces approaching 80 and 90 years of age that are not only worn on a regular basis but keep time within chronometer specs.

The oldest piece in my stable is a GMT gilt dial bearing a 1.3 mil number. This watch is accurate to within LESS than +1 sec. a day. It has been used, but cared for, and still has it's orginal dial and hands,


Close up of dial.


I know the modern 3xxx fast beat movements are tough accurate movements, but I'm of the camp that just feels the 15xx movements were over engineered monsters that just absorbed tremendous punishment and never looked back.
Watchmakers whom I respect feel the the human engineering that went into these movements simply put them in a different league. I'm not a watchmaker, but I know from years of real world experience these are unbeliveable movements.
My most accurate watch is this "old sub" that saw the bad side of Vietnam. It runs at +/- 0 deviation.

Damn fine watch that 1.3 mil GMT!

As far as maintenance I am of the opinion that a movement service/dissassembly is required every 5-6 years but that a case refinish should be put of for every 2 services as, especially on vintage pieces, you don't want to overpolish the case.

As far as collectors operating 80yr timepieces, what can I say. I am stunned.

These are exactly the kinds of things one should say to the many who first-hand reject the very notion of expensive, quality timepieces with the usual line "A 10$ Timex will show the time just as well"...

[RLXGMT-1675]

Originally Posted by mikey

My watch is a product of the SS to TT conversion and I love it. Paying more for the same thing makes no sense!

Mikey,

My comments were not against any Rolex owner, such as yourself, from doing whatever one wants with something one legally owns.

The issue is when certain people in the watch trading/repair/service industry misrepresent such items and neglecting to mention their history, i.e. how they started out.

[Andad]

Absolutely Amazing Rolex and the PIX are excellent.

Thank you Mike (and others) for the history and the details of this one. I could sit and read it over and over.

[RLXGMT-1675]

Mike,

Thanks a bunch for all that great info.

This place is truly a treasure chest of info on our shared passion, Rolex watches!

I am very proud to be a member of TRF and look forward to posting pics of:
1) An OQ 19018 (1987)
2) Rose TT DJ 1601 (1967)
in due course.

Thanks for everybody's responses!

[RLXGMT-1675]

Mikey,

My comments were not against any Rolex owner, such as yourself, doing whatever one wants with something one legally owns.

The issue is when certain people in the watch trading/repair/service industry misrepresent such watches and neglect to mention their history & subsequent "transformation" when they are reselling them.

[Rockrolex]

RLXGMT, that is one beautiful vintage GMT. She cleans up real nice, too.

Wear it in good health. With proper maintenance, it should last for several lifetimes.

[givenup]

lucky boy. money well spent. give it another 40years of love.