Balance wheel not turning with wheels

[mikie1]

(I have to push the balance stop spring back manually)The balance stop spring is installed & moves forward when the stem is pulled out to the 2 positions but the spring does not retract back when the stem is pushed back in. What's missing? I can see the notch in the end of the spring through a hole when the end of the spring moves but what goes in that notch? When I rotate the barrel slightly all wheel run as does the escape but the balance does nothing. Its not binding. What to look for please?

[shofzr]

The set lever has a post that should be inside the this slot on the stop spring to pull it back from the balance wheel when the stem is pushed in






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[mikie1]

Thanks. Is that whats keeping the balance from working?

[mikie1]

I have to uninstall and reinstall the lever then push the spring back so that the set lever post goes inside the spring? Thanks

Originally Posted by shofzr

The set lever has a post that should be inside the this slot on the stop spring to pull it back from the balance wheel when the stem is pushed in






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[shofzr]

Originally Posted by mikie1

I have to uninstall and reinstall the lever then push the spring back so that the set lever post goes inside the spring? Thanks

1.Uninstall the set lever,
2.push the stop spring back,
3.reinstall the set lever making sure the post is inside the slot in the stop spring.

[mikie1]

Great thanks again...will that take care of the balance wheel not working?

[shofzr]

Originally Posted by mikie1

Great thanks again...will that take care of the balance wheel not working?

If the only problem was the stop spring not retracting from the balance wheel when the stem is pushed in, then yes this will let the balance wheel work.


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[mikie1]

With your help the spring works perfectly now. Balance wheel not binding but no movement when other wheels turning. Waiting for new spring for cam yoke(it flew the coop). Could that be the problem? Balance spring attached just fine. (I really have to learn about movements)
Thanks
Al

[shofzr]

Originally Posted by mikie1

With your help the spring works perfectly now. Balance wheel not binding but no movement when other wheels turning. Waiting for new spring for cam yoke(it flew the coop). Could that be the problem? Balance spring attached just fine. (I really have to learn about movements)
Thanks
Al

Glad you got the stop spring sorted.

The train wheels should not move unless the balance wheel is moving also.

Is the pallet fork installed and engaging the escape wheel correct?


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[mikie1]

Yes the fork touches the escape & if I turn the bal wheel the fork moves towards the other side. Then the wheels start to turn but the balance wheel never turns by itself. Waiting for part spring for cam yoke & calendar wheel nut. Could this be the cause?Thanks

[shofzr]

Originally Posted by mikie1

Yes the fork touches the escape & if I turn the bal wheel the fork moves towards the other side. Then the wheels start to turn but the balance wheel never turns by itself. Waiting for part spring for cam yoke & calendar wheel nut. Could this be the cause?Thanks

So when you remove the balance wheel, and pallet fork the train will spin free and has backlash when you give the winding crown a turn?




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[mikie1]

yes

[Vanessa CW21]

The wheels shouldn't be turning when the pallet fork is stopping the escape wheel.
This is the part where a real watchmaker is needed...
My first guess would be that the pallet stones need to be adjusted. If that's what the problem is, I would recommend getting a new pallet fork, because I find the chance of you being able to perform such repair very slim.
And again, without seeing the watch, it is all just a guessing game for us.
I hope this whole adventure of yours is a lesson to all watch enthusiasts here, who would have considered to try and service their own watch. It really isn't that simple !

I'm sorry, I don't mean to put you down, but this watch will never run (the way its supposed to) without getting this reserviced by an actual watchmaker.

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[mikie1]

That is not what is happening. The wheels don't run with the fork stopping the escape whell. Again we have a communication problem. Shofzr has been very helpful and right on the money.

[mikie1]

If you are fixing your own watch don't give up and seek sage advise.

Originally Posted by Vanessa CW21

The wheels shouldn't be turning when the pallet fork is stopping the escape wheel.
This is the part where a real watchmaker is needed...
My first guess would be that the pallet stones need to be adjusted. If that's what the problem is, I would recommend getting a new pallet fork, because I find the chance of you being able to perform such repair very slim.
And again, without seeing the watch, it is all just a guessing game for us.
I hope this whole adventure of yours is a lesson to all watch enthusiasts here, who would have considered to try and service their own watch. It really isn't that simple !

I'm sorry, I don't mean to put you down, but this watch will never run (the way its supposed to) without getting this reserviced by an actual watchmaker.

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[Vanessa CW21]

Originally Posted by mikie1

That is not what is happening. The wheels don't run with the fork stopping the escape whell. Again we have a communication problem. Shofzr has been very helpful and right on the money.

Okay I misunderstood.
Did you check the endshake on all the gears and the balance?
Are the cap jewels lined up and oiled properly? Is the hair spring 100% flat, centered and free? Is the roller jewel in line with the pallet fork and escape wheel? Those are all things that have to be guaranteed perfect before it will run.

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[Vanessa CW21]

And I'm going to leave it at this last advice.
Good luck with the rest of your journey. I hope it works out for you.


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[mikie1]

I will check it all when I get to that point

Originally Posted by Vanessa CW21

Okay I misunderstood.
Did you check the endshake on all the gears and the balance?
Are the cap jewels lined up and oiled properly? Is the hair spring 100% flat, centered and free? Is the roller jewel in line with the pallet fork and escape wheel? Those are all things that have to be guaranteed perfect before it will run.

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[mikie1]

When I turn the balance wheel about 1.5 revolution to stop then 1.5 revolution in the opposite direction to stop the pallet fork is stopped by the escape wheel. The balance spring is flat and clear.

Originally Posted by mikie1

If you are fixing your own watch don't give up and seek sage advise.

[kanikune]

One thing you have to make sure, when installing the balance wheel:
My hint is to add little bit tension to the mainspring before installing. Because of the tension the pallet now leans to other banking pin. Make sure, when installing the balance that the roller jewel comes to the SAME side, than the pallet is leaning. If you don't make sure this happens, you have scenario, you might have as we speak.

This ensures, that when balance is in rest and no tension in mainspring, the roller jewel is between the pallet fork horns.

[mikie1]

I was actually thinking about that this morning(watched a "how watches work video) I'm a watch neophyte. Thanks great hint.

Originally Posted by kanikune

One thing you have to make sure, when installing the balance wheel:
My hint is to add little bit tension to the mainspring before installing. Because of the tension the pallet now leans to other banking pin. Make sure, when installing the balance that the roller jewel comes to the SAME side, than the pallet is leaning. If you don't make sure this happens, you have scenario, you might have as we speak.

This ensures, that when balance is in rest and no tension in mainspring, the roller jewel is between the pallet fork horns.

[kanikune]

I'll go back to the "ensures". The previous does not alone ensure that the roller jewel is between the pallet horns when balance is in rest and no tension in mainspring, but applies if beat is centered.

That should be the case is adjustments of the balance cock are not touched and the hairspring is not malformed.

[mikie1]

Do you mean by "leaning" if the fork is to right, the "jewel" is to the right as well?

Originally Posted by mikie1

I will check it all when I get to that point

[mikie1]

Do you mean by "leaning" if the fork is to right, the "jewel" is to the right as well?

Originally Posted by kanikune

I'll go back to the "ensures". The previous does not alone ensure that the roller jewel is between the pallet horns when balance is in rest and no tension in mainspring, but applies if beat is centered.

That should be the case is adjustments of the balance cock are not touched and the hairspring is not malformed.

[kanikune]

Yes, if the pallet is leaning to the right banking pin from the viewer perspective, also the roller pin needs to come to the right side of the (& in front of the pallet again from viewer perspective) balance axle.

[mikie1]

Originally Posted by kanikune

Yes, if the pallet is leaning to the right banking pin from the viewer perspective, also the roller pin needs to come to the right side of the (& in front of the pallet again from viewer perspective) balance axle.

[kanikune]

For you I made this freehand-paint-drawing-illustration.

[mikie1]

Thank you

[mikie1]

"Viewer Perspective" looking from fork end towards escape or escape end towards fork end? Thanks

Originally Posted by kanikune

Yes, if the pallet is leaning to the right banking pin from the viewer perspective, also the roller pin needs to come to the right side of the (& in front of the pallet again from viewer perspective) balance axle.

[kanikune]

I meant perspective, where first in sight there is balance wheel, then pallet and finally escape wheel.