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newbirolex · 2 August 2008, 06:40 AM

This is a vintage 1950s Rolex watch that belonged to my grandfather and I was hoping to get more information on it, in terms of value and any other information. (I am not looking to sell it, just for personal curiosity)

The model is 6205, and there is a word engraved along the side of case when band is removed that says "BREVET"

I think the serial # is 21340

any information is greatly appreciated, thanks

more pics can be supplied if needed

Mr Sandman · 2 August 2008, 08:03 AM

Hi and welcome to TRF buddy...Its a really nice watch you have there.I will look in the books but I have not seen one like yours before.I'm sure more qualified members will here soon to give you more info in due course

stevemulholland3 · 2 August 2008, 08:05 AM

thats an old submariner from at least before 1955-looks like an original dial.
very sweet-you dont want to sell?

stevemulholland3 · 2 August 2008, 08:10 AM

more pics too!!!that is sweeet!
I dont thing the end links are original but send some pics of the band as well.

Tools · 2 August 2008, 08:13 AM

a 6205 would be one of the originals from 1954/55 with the A296 movement..

If original, it could be worth many thousands of dollars..

The bracelet looks like it doesn't belong and perhaps the numbers have been refinished...

This one needs a professional look if the Movement is genuine..

JJ Irani · 2 August 2008, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tools

a 6205 would be one of the originals from 1954/55 with the A296 movement..

If original, it could be worth many thousands of dollars..

The bracelet looks like it doesn't belong and perhaps the numbers have been refinished...

This one needs a professional look if the Movement is genuine..

Agreed, Larry......that looks like a rare find. Could be worth a packet!!

SLS · 2 August 2008, 08:18 AM

Can you get a close up of the dial, use the macro (looks like a flower) function on your camera. I think the dial may have been redone. Either way, a great piece to have.
~Scott

Mr Sandman · 2 August 2008, 08:25 AM

I've just had a quick scan at the book by Dowling & Hess on chapter 12.

It states that the 1st sub model number was 6204 and differed massively from the current sub in that it lacked nearly all of the features that are in place today.The very first model had parallel hands and not the current 'mercedes' type and also had no crown guards either.It was in production for less than 2 years before being replaced with the 6538 and the less expensive 6536.The book doe'snt mention any arabic numbers on the dial so I would suggest that your watch is VERY,VERY RARE to the point that it may just be a one off but dont quote me on that.

Your best bet would be so ask a Rolex expert or even Rolex themselves and I dont mean just popping into your local dealer either...This needs to be looked at by someone who can tell you exactly what you've got and its true value..

Keep us informed as to your course of action please.......We would all be very interested

JJ Irani · 2 August 2008, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Sandman

I've just had a quick scan at the book by Dowling & Hess on chapter 12.

It states that the 1st sub model number was 6204 and differed massively from the current sub in that it lacked nearly all of the features that are in place today.The very first model had parallel hands and not the current 'mercedes' type and also had no crown guards either.It was in production for less than 2 years before being replaced with the 6538 and the less expensive 6536.The book doe'snt mention any arabic numbers on the dial so I would suggest that your watch is VERY,VERY RARE to the point that it may just be a one off but dont quote me on that.

Your best bet would be so ask a Rolex expert or even Rolex themselves and I dont mean just popping into your local dealer either...This needs to be looked at by someone who can tell you exactly what you've got and its true value..

Keep us informed as to your course of action please.......We would all be very interested

Good supportive post, Jim. Thanks!!

Mr Sandman · 2 August 2008, 08:28 AM

Any chance of some more pics including the bracelet please and the clasp on the bracelet.....Could it be a very early Jubilee ??

Tools · 2 August 2008, 08:29 AM

We talk about the 6205 in a couple of places in the Reference Library..(vintage) Sub...

This one has everything you would expect to find..... Except the numbers seem to have been added/redone.

newbirolex · 2 August 2008, 08:46 AM

thanks for the responses guys.

Yes, the band is not the original.

The movement has never been altered as far as I know, the watch has had only 1 original owner, my grandfather (prior to me taking possession of it) who purchased the watch new when it first came out.

I'll take more photos and upload them by monday of detail shots.

stevemulholland3 · 2 August 2008, 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tools

We talk about the 6205 in a couple of places in the Reference Library..(vintage) Sub...

This one has everything you would expect to find..... Except the numbers seem to have been added/redone.

I have done more searching and have dug up some correct dials and I have to agree that the dial is at least touched up-and isnt original in that design.

stevemulholland3 · 2 August 2008, 09:04 AM

here is a correct dial courtesy of richardnyc

T3RoyalOak · 2 August 2008, 09:11 AM

Regardless, it is a cool watch, rare no matter what we find. I have seen it in person (I know the owner of the watch). The first thing I noticed was the Arabic Numerals when he showed me. We couldn't find any dial that looked like that.

Tools · 2 August 2008, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T3RoyalOak

Regardless, it is a cool watch, rare no matter what we find. I have seen it in person (I know the owner of the watch). The first thing I noticed was the Arabic Numerals when he showed me. We couldn't find any dial that looked like that.

It also has the lume dot out at the end of the second hand which was only used for a very short time...

The hands alone could be worth a fortune.........

mike · 2 August 2008, 11:08 AM

BREVET is correct with the reference number. The dial looks at best to my unexpert eye to have been redone. Not only the Arabic Numerals, but also the minute markings around the dial.

I have seen the seconds hand on a 6204. It's possible sometime in it's past the seconds hand was replaced?.

Check out the dial archive here,

http://www.network54.com/Forum/207593/

topcat30093 · 2 August 2008, 11:17 AM

Intriguing!
Thank you for showing it to us.

mgm · 2 August 2008, 11:37 AM

Or possibly an unarchived dial. It is clear that the known dial has a very different placement of the coronet and lettering. An interesting bit of detective work ahead!

toph · 2 August 2008, 01:47 PM

this is not a 6204- it is earlier and is for sure pre 1953 if that is the original dial. it has the seconds hand with the circle at the end. there are many submariners in 1953 and previously that have had the name "submariner" obscured from the dial for copryright reasons.

Mr Sandman · 2 August 2008, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toph

this is not a 6204- it is earlier and is for sure pre 1953 if that is the original dial. it has the seconds hand with the circle at the end. there are many submariners in 1953 and previously that have had the name "submariner" obscured from the dial for copryright reasons.

No ones saying it is a 6204

Its allready been identified as a 6205

Its the dial that has thrown many of us as its so unusal.

shedlock2000 · 2 August 2008, 07:41 PM

What a fantastic thread! curiouser and curiouser!! Carry on, i would be very interested in an estimate of worth. Fantastic legacy your grandfather left you. Good luck in your investigations.

toph · 2 August 2008, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Sandman

No ones saying it is a 6204

Its allready been identified as a 6205

Its the dial that has thrown many of us as its so unusal.

ok my mistake but considering the 6205 came after the 6204 then what i said still applies for the 6205- i think you get the idea. if you don't- i was saying it is earlier than the 6204 and thus 6205. 6200 maybe?

furthermore seeing as it has been identified as 6205 but not really- i will say that dial was PRIOR to the 6205 circa 1953

stevemulholland3 · 2 August 2008, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shedlock2000

What a fantastic thread! curiouser and curiouser!! Carry on, i would be very interested in an estimate of worth. Fantastic legacy your grandfather left you. Good luck in your investigations.

a rough estimate of worth would be about 10-15k if the dial is a redone one(which it appears to be)
also there is no provenance,and this is just for the head.there are many other issues that could effect pricing,either positive or negatively-I would have to see it to ascertain a probable value.but my estimate is a good start.

mickeydainish · 2 August 2008, 10:05 PM

Beautiful though... ver nice....:-)

Lol-x · 2 August 2008, 11:06 PM

Very interesting, I can't really add to what the guys have already said/identified. I expect it is worth quite a few $$$$

ratae1950 · 3 August 2008, 01:18 AM

For me a great educational thread. Thanks all

Brcmpbl · 3 August 2008, 03:38 AM

That is a cool rig regardless.

newbirolex · 3 August 2008, 03:49 AM

thanks for the replies, here are some closeup shots that might prove helpful

when I first acquired the watch, it was only the case, the strap was added afterwards (which some eagle eyes already noticed wasnt original)

T3RoyalOak · 4 August 2008, 10:33 AM

Those are some clear shots. In your honor, I will wear my only Rolex tomorrow to work. Let it be a Rolex day at SD.

2 August 2008, 06:40 AM	#1
newbirolex "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: los angeles Posts: 4	Help a Newbie! Identify my Rolex This is a vintage 1950s Rolex watch that belonged to my grandfather and I was hoping to get more information on it, in terms of value and any other information. (I am not looking to sell it, just for personal curiosity) The model is 6205, and there is a word engraved along the side of case when band is removed that says "BREVET" I think the serial # is 21340 any information is greatly appreciated, thanks more pics can be supplied if needed

2 August 2008, 08:13 AM	#5
Tools TRF Moderator & 2024 SubLV41 Patron Join Date: May 2007 Real Name: Larry Location: Mojave Desert Watch: GMT's Posts: 43,515	a 6205 would be one of the originals from 1954/55 with the A296 movement.. If original, it could be worth many thousands of dollars.. The bracelet looks like it doesn't belong and perhaps the numbers have been refinished... This one needs a professional look if the Movement is genuine.. __________________ (Chill ... It's just a watch Forum.....) NAWCC Member

2 August 2008, 08:29 AM	#11
Tools TRF Moderator & 2024 SubLV41 Patron Join Date: May 2007 Real Name: Larry Location: Mojave Desert Watch: GMT's Posts: 43,515	We talk about the 6205 in a couple of places in the Reference Library..(vintage) Sub... This one has everything you would expect to find..... Except the numbers seem to have been added/redone. __________________ (Chill ... It's just a watch Forum.....) NAWCC Member

2 August 2008, 09:04 AM	#14
stevemulholland3 Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Real Name: steven Location: tampa bay Watch: 1680 18k sub Posts: 6,672	here is a correct dial courtesy of richardnyc Attached Images

2 August 2008, 11:17 AM	#18
topcat30093 "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Real Name: Tony Location: England Posts: 5,460	Intriguing! Thank you for showing it to us. __________________

2 August 2008, 08:03 AM	#2
Mr Sandman "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Real Name: Jim Location: Devon U.K Posts: 527	Hi and welcome to TRF buddy...Its a really nice watch you have there.I will look in the books but I have not seen one like yours before.I'm sure more qualified members will here soon to give you more info in due course

2 August 2008, 08:05 AM	#3
stevemulholland3 Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Real Name: steven Location: tampa bay Watch: 1680 18k sub Posts: 6,672	thats an old submariner from at least before 1955-looks like an original dial. very sweet-you dont want to sell?

2 August 2008, 08:10 AM	#4
stevemulholland3 Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Real Name: steven Location: tampa bay Watch: 1680 18k sub Posts: 6,672	more pics too!!!that is sweeet! I dont thing the end links are original but send some pics of the band as well.

2 August 2008, 08:18 AM	#7
SLS "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Real Name: Scott Location: GMT -7 Watch: GMT's & Sub's Posts: 10,401	Can you get a close up of the dial, use the macro (looks like a flower) function on your camera. I think the dial may have been redone. Either way, a great piece to have. ~Scott

2 August 2008, 08:25 AM	#8
Mr Sandman "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Real Name: Jim Location: Devon U.K Posts: 527	I've just had a quick scan at the book by Dowling & Hess on chapter 12. It states that the 1st sub model number was 6204 and differed massively from the current sub in that it lacked nearly all of the features that are in place today.The very first model had parallel hands and not the current 'mercedes' type and also had no crown guards either.It was in production for less than 2 years before being replaced with the 6538 and the less expensive 6536.The book doe'snt mention any arabic numbers on the dial so I would suggest that your watch is VERY,VERY RARE to the point that it may just be a one off but dont quote me on that. Your best bet would be so ask a Rolex expert or even Rolex themselves and I dont mean just popping into your local dealer either...This needs to be looked at by someone who can tell you exactly what you've got and its true value.. Keep us informed as to your course of action please.......We would all be very interested

2 August 2008, 08:28 AM	#10
Mr Sandman "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Real Name: Jim Location: Devon U.K Posts: 527	Any chance of some more pics including the bracelet please and the clasp on the bracelet.....Could it be a very early Jubilee ??

2 August 2008, 08:46 AM	#12
newbirolex "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: los angeles Posts: 4	thanks for the responses guys. Yes, the band is not the original. The movement has never been altered as far as I know, the watch has had only 1 original owner, my grandfather (prior to me taking possession of it) who purchased the watch new when it first came out. I'll take more photos and upload them by monday of detail shots.

2 August 2008, 09:11 AM	#15
T3RoyalOak "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 4	Regardless, it is a cool watch, rare no matter what we find. I have seen it in person (I know the owner of the watch). The first thing I noticed was the Arabic Numerals when he showed me. We couldn't find any dial that looked like that.

2 August 2008, 11:08 AM	#17
mike "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 22,683	BREVET is correct with the reference number. The dial looks at best to my unexpert eye to have been redone. Not only the Arabic Numerals, but also the minute markings around the dial. I have seen the seconds hand on a 6204. It's possible sometime in it's past the seconds hand was replaced?. Check out the dial archive here, http://www.network54.com/Forum/207593/

2 August 2008, 11:37 AM	#19
mgm "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Real Name: Greg Merrick Location: Wisconsin, USA Posts: 648	Or possibly an unarchived dial. It is clear that the known dial has a very different placement of the coronet and lettering. An interesting bit of detective work ahead! __________________ Gregory

2 August 2008, 01:47 PM	#20
toph "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Real Name: ChrisTOPHer Location: Sydney Watch: Rolex, Brellum, Posts: 12,601	this is not a 6204- it is earlier and is for sure pre 1953 if that is the original dial. it has the seconds hand with the circle at the end. there are many submariners in 1953 and previously that have had the name "submariner" obscured from the dial for copryright reasons. __________________ "Where no counsel is the people fall, but in the multitude of counselors there is safety." Member No.# 11795

2 August 2008, 07:41 PM	#22
shedlock2000 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: May 2008 Real Name: Steve Location: Canada Watch: 16753; Bellini Dia Posts: 1,770	What a fantastic thread! curiouser and curiouser!! Carry on, i would be very interested in an estimate of worth. Fantastic legacy your grandfather left you. Good luck in your investigations. __________________ The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it. SS Submariner no date 1992 (sold); SS GMT II 2007 (sold); SS GMT II C 2008 ('M' series) (sold); SS Sub C 2011 (sold); BB GMT 1971 (sold); Omega 50th GMT

2 August 2008, 10:05 PM	#25
mickeydainish Banned Join Date: Mar 2008 Real Name: Michael Location: LaLa Land Watch: Sub Date 16610 Posts: 1,757	Beautiful though... ver nice....:-)

2 August 2008, 11:06 PM	#26
Lol-x Facilitator Join Date: Nov 2005 Real Name: Steve Location: Omnipresent Posts: 33,593	Very interesting, I can't really add to what the guys have already said/identified. I expect it is worth quite a few $$$$ __________________ *Most folks are about as happy as they make up their minds to be.* ~Abraham Lincoln Nothing compares to the simple pleasure of a bike ride. ~John F. Kennedy ROLEXploitation - yeah I'm a victim

3 August 2008, 01:18 AM	#27
ratae1950 "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Real Name: Peter Location: Cambridge Ma Posts: 2,331	For me a great educational thread. Thanks all __________________ Yunnoworameenmiduck

3 August 2008, 03:38 AM	#28
Brcmpbl "TRF" Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Calgary, Canada Watch: Sea-Dweller Posts: 164	That is a cool rig regardless.

3 August 2008, 03:49 AM	#29
newbirolex "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: los angeles Posts: 4	thanks for the replies, here are some closeup shots that might prove helpful when I first acquired the watch, it was only the case, the strap was added afterwards (which some eagle eyes already noticed wasnt original)

4 August 2008, 10:33 AM	#30
T3RoyalOak "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 4	Those are some clear shots. In your honor, I will wear my only Rolex tomorrow to work. Let it be a Rolex day at SD.

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