fine, broad, japanese, german, etc.

[Juantxo]

Yes, I understand that Japanese nibs draw thinner lines than European ones. Yes, I know there are charts that offer sizes in millimeters and so on. However, it'll always be a mess.

I recently bought from Classic Fountain Pens a Pelikan fine nib with stub modification. Shrtly after, I bought from the same outfit a Platinum #3376 with broad nib and stub modification.

The Pelikan draws a reasonably thick line and floats across the paper. The Platinum is stiff, dry, unpleasant to write with. As a matter of fact, you can notice in the attached picture that when writing with the Platinum the handwriting is smaller than is the case when writing with the Pelikan because the nib rather sticks to the paper.

I like the way Pelikan nibs write.

[Bisquitlips]

Originally Posted by Juantxo

Yes, I understand that Japanese nibs draw thinner lines than European ones. Yes, I know there are charts that offer sizes in millimeters and so on. However, it'll always be a mess.

I recently bought from Classic Fountain Pens a Pelikan fine nib with stub modification. Shrtly after, I bought from the same outfit a Platinum #3376 with broad nib and stub modification.

The Pelikan draws a reasonably thick line and floats across the paper. The Platinum is stiff, dry, unpleasant to write with. As a matter of fact, you can notice in the attached picture that when writing with the Platinum the handwriting is smaller than is the case when writing with the Pelikan because the nib rather sticks to the paper.

I like the way Pelikan nibs write.

How are you holding your pen Juan?

Offset to left or right or straight on? Try different grips and angles and see if you can get a better performance.

[Juantxo]

I write with the tip of the nib pretty much flat on the paper as otherwise most nibs will be a bit scratchy unless worked on 12,000 paper or so.

By the way, I just found a post on the Fountain Pen Geeks forum dating to April 2015 where they announce that the ao-tamenuri had been discontinued. Which makes me think that the one ao-tamenuri at nibs.com may be a returned pen from someone who found fault with it. I've been told the pen is "new", but someone else at nibs.com told me they have no way of telling whether the pen is a returned pen or not. At least it seems as if the pen has been sitting at their shop for over a year and a half.

I don't want to be anal about the whole thing but I also don't appreciate being taken for a fool. So now I don't know what to do. The pen is being paid for, with extras, by PayPal. All this impersonal hard-core business world of the Internet eludes me. I'm from a different era, from a different culture.

[jar]

I'm in the middle of a three part comparison of medium nib pens from Japan against those from other areas. I posted the first part already where I compare six medium nib pens from Japan. I've selected the next half dozen pens, one from the US, England, France, Germany, Italy and Switzerland and hope to get pictures of them today and post Part 2 very soon. The third iteration will be three from each group directly compared.

The thread is on fpGeeks and also FPN if anyone is interested.

AbE: @Juantxo

Your issue may be related to wetness with the pens. Pelikan is generally a really wet writer which is why Pelikans ink (4001) is generally considered a drier ink. Platinum (and Nakaya) pens are generally moderately wet but drier than Pelikan or Montblanc or Pilot or Sailor. It sounds like you enjoy wetter pens and so the Platinum/Nakaya pens may not be the best fit for your hand.

[Juantxo]

Originally Posted by jar

I'm in the middle of a three part comparison of medium nib pens from Japan against those from other areas. I posted the first part already where I compare six medium nib pens from Japan. I've selected the next half dozen pens, one from the US, England, France, Germany, Italy and Switzerland and hope to get pictures of them today and post Part 2 very soon. The third iteration will be three from each group directly compared.

The thread is on fpGeeks and also FPN if anyone is interested.

AbE: @Juantxo

Your issue may be related to wetness with the pens. Pelikan is generally a really wet writer which is why Pelikans ink (4001) is generally considered a drier ink. Platinum (and Nakaya) pens are generally moderately wet but drier than Pelikan or Montblanc or Pilot or Sailor. It sounds like you enjoy wetter pens and so the Platinum/Nakaya pens may not be the best fit for your hand.

Oddly enough, yesterday I rinsed my Platinum #3776 broad nib pen which I had been using with red Skrip ink. Early today I filled it with Akkerman #27 green ink and the difference is remarkable. With Akkerman the pen writes so much better. Go figure.

[jar]

Akkerman inks are generally wetter than Sheaffer red Skrip.

[Juantxo]

Originally Posted by jar

Akkerman inks are generally wetter than Sheaffer red Skrip.

Indeed, they are. Beautiful green color, too.

[Juantxo]

[jar]

On the subject of fine broad Japanese German; here is one image from my medium nib comparison page.

Three were written with Japanese medium nib pens, three with medium nib pens from the US & Eur.

[Juantxo]

Originally Posted by jar

On the subject of fine broad Japanese German; here is one image from my medium nib comparison page.

Three were written with Japanese medium nib pens, three with medium nib pens from the US & Eur.

Is it all the same ink...?

[Bisquitlips]

Originally Posted by Juantxo

I write with the tip of the nib pretty much flat on the paper as otherwise most nibs will be a bit scratchy unless worked on 12,000 paper or so.

By the way, I just found a post on the Fountain Pen Geeks forum dating to April 2015 where they announce that the ao-tamenuri had been discontinued. Which makes me think that the one ao-tamenuri at nibs.com may be a returned pen from someone who found fault with it. I've been told the pen is "new", but someone else at nibs.com told me they have no way of telling whether the pen is a returned pen or not. At least it seems as if the pen has been sitting at their shop for over a year and a half.

I don't want to be anal about the whole thing but I also don't appreciate being taken for a fool. So now I don't know what to do. The pen is being paid for, with extras, by PayPal. All this impersonal hard-core business world of the Internet eludes me. I'm from a different era, from a different culture.

Well... I think I would take it that the deal is done, but a return can be accomplished.

It may cost you a few dollars to do so, but if you have any inkling that things are not as they should be I would return it without any hesitation.

Unless it is an option to cancel the transaction now and that is something you desire to do. It may not be. Anyway a return could certainly be an option. I would give it a try. Also it sounds that you may be getting a VERY rare pen with no more being created ever.

I certainly hope that when you receive the pen it turns out to be better than you ever anticipated. That is one gorgeous writing instrument Juan!

[Juantxo]

Originally Posted by Bisquitlips

Well... I think I would take it that the deal is done, but a return can be accomplished.

It may cost you a few dollars to do so, but if you have any inkling that things are not as they should be I would return it without any hesitation.

Unless it is an option to cancel the transaction now and that is something you desire to do. It may not be. Anyway a return could certainly be an option. I would give it a try. Also it sounds that you may be getting a VERY rare pen with no more being created ever.

I certainly hope that when you receive the pen it turns out to be better than you ever anticipated. That is one gorgeous writing instrument Juan!

Today I received a very courteous and thorough email with reassurances that the pen was recently received from the factory as it was an old order. Evidently, it takes Nakaya quite some time to produce the pens and to comply with orders. Thus, I'm proceeding with the purchase.

I had other options in terms of colors but at least to start I prefer the more sober blue/green than a basically red pen. As you mention, this would be a very unique pen, in particular considering that consistency in the obtaining the color is very difficult. And, of course, the color has been discontinued.

I must point out that I also received some very worthy advice from our in-house Enola Gay martial artist and short-story master.

[jar]

Originally Posted by Juantxo

Is it all the same ink...?

Nope, different inks and I removed all the color information since I had earlier posted writing samples that identified the pen that also showed what color ink was in each.

In the comparison I used cartridges from the manufacturer except for those pens that used international standard ones. In those I used the same Diamine color in all those pens.

But the important point is to hopefully show that what we know is true 'taint necessarily so.

The reason to use the makers cartridges was pretty simple; the manufacturer likely tunes their own pens for their own inks.

But as you discovered, changing inks can totally change the performance of a given pen.

But there are also many truisms that surround fountain pen lore that also 'taint necessarily so like the story of Waterman and the contract and that Japanese pens write one size finer than European pens.

Sometimes it is true but again, sometimes it ain't.

[Juantxo]

Originally Posted by jar

Nope, different inks and I removed all the color information since I had earlier posted writing samples that identified the pen that also showed what color ink was in each.

In the comparison I used cartridges from the manufacturer except for those pens that used international standard ones. In those I used the same Diamine color in all those pens.

But the important point is to hopefully show that what we know is true 'taint necessarily so.

The reason to use the makers cartridges was pretty simple; the manufacturer likely tunes their own pens for their own inks.

But as you discovered, changing inks can totally change the performance of a given pen.

But there are also many truisms that surround fountain pen lore that also 'taint necessarily so like the story of Waterman and the contract and that Japanese pens write one size finer than European pens.

Sometimes it is true but again, sometimes it ain't.

I love feeling like I'm back in college So much learning, so much interesting information. Thank you. And what you say, Jim, matches my empirical experience. The range of variations within a given brand and size is wide.

Now, would you please elaborate on the Waterman mention, and "the contract". Thank you so much.

[jar]

Originally Posted by Juantxo

I love feeling like I'm back in college So much learning, so much interesting information. Thank you. And what you say, Jim, matches my empirical experience. The range of variations within a given brand and size is wide.

Now, would you please elaborate on the Waterman mention, and "the contract". Thank you so much.

There is a story that is far too often mentioned as fact that what prompted Waterman to invent the fountain pen was once when he went to sign an important contract a blob of ink fell on the paper and ruined the sale.

But there is absolutely no evidence of that happening and the first mention of it was in a newspaper story in the late thirties IIRC.

[Juantxo]

Originally Posted by jar

There is a story that is far too often mentioned as fact that what prompted Waterman to invent the fountain pen was once when he went to sign an important contract a blob of ink fell on the paper and ruined the sale.

But there is absolutely no evidence of that happening and the first mention of it was in a newspaper story in the late thirties IIRC.

Another tome to the collection. Thank you.