16610LV The real 50th Anniversary sub???

[onshow]

Hi all,

With the price of these beautiful watches increasing and in high demand it's interesting to see the price variance between the flat 4 and pointed 4.

The big question is which year is the genuine 50th Anniversary watch?

The first 16610LV's were sold in 2003 but the first sub was released in 1954 at Baselworld so a 2003 16610LV would make it 49 years since the first sub so it begs the question are the 2004 model/purchased 16610LV's the genuine 50th Anniversary models and the ones that are most desirable?

This would make the F series the genuine 50th Anniversary watches???

Thoughts???

[mjg002]

Well I'm sure this will elicit many conflicting views so I will sit back and enjoy the show...

Meantime, I just bought an F Series for that very reason - and specifically a mid series F series from 2004 which does NOT have a Flat 4 as I wanted one I could wear without concern - otherwise it would have inevitably become a safe queen...! But as far as I am concerned it is still a "genuine 50th Anniversary watch"... :-)

[aquatimerfla]

Originally Posted by onshow

Hi all,

With the price of these beautiful watches increasing and in high demand it's interesting to see the price variance between the flat 4 and pointed 4.

The big question is which year is the genuine 50th Anniversary watch?

The first 16610LV's were sold in 2003 but the first sub was released in 1954 at Baselworld so a 2003 16610LV would make it 49 years since the first sub so it begs the question are the 2004 model/purchased 16610LV's the genuine 50th Anniversary models and the ones that are most desirable?

This would make the F series the genuine 50th Anniversary watches???

Thoughts???

As far as Rolex is concerned. Any 16610LV is considered the anniversary submariner. Its only collectors who deem the ‘first’ run as true 50th.

Personally to me the 16610LV to own is the ‘last’ run random serial. Either way all are considered anniversary submariners.

[ajas]

As far as I am concerned Rolex calls 16610LV 50 anniversary.
As this is their product they have right to do so.


Sent from my SM-N935F using Tapatalk

[onshow]

Yes from a "collectors" prospective I would assume a true 50th Anniversary watch would be a 16610LV from 2004 but agree all 16610Lv's are obviously labeled a 50th Anniversary edition.

It comes down to the little details like date, fat 4, 5 ticks under Swiss Made that collectors look for hence the price difference to other 11610Lv's.

Keen to hear others thoughts and opinions.

[Casey VP-26]

I would think a true 50th anniversary should mean exactly that (not 49 or 51 or any other).

[meganfox17]

Correct me if I'm wrong guys !

Rolex Sub
✓Research & Development 1950-1953
✓Sub 6200 Born May 1953
✓Official Announcement of the Sub to the World Sept 1953
✓Passed 132 dives tests of Institute of Deep Sea Research May-Oct 1953
✓Official Launch of Sub 6204 Basel Spring Watch Fair 1954
✓Official sale to public : 4th quarter / Q4 of 1954
✓Submariner font on dial Dec 1954

Summary : 1953 is indeed the birth year of the Rolex Sub

[onshow]

It's a bit like a car, it takes years of research and development including promoting and advertising but it's the year it's first launched that counts.

No diffetent to having a child. We don't count the time it's developing we count from the day it's released to the world.

Just my 2 cents.

First sub released 1954 at baselworld which makes 2004 the true Anniversary in my opinion.

[Loevhagen]

Funny thread. :)

Then the Y-series 16610LV from late 2002 is not worth much.

[larsr]

Originally Posted by Loevhagen

Funny thread. :)

Then the Y-series 16610LV from late 2002 is not worth much.

You are so correct! And I am more than willing to buy any and all for realistic prices that reflect this obvious fact!

[Johny]

All 16610LVs are anniversary models. Collectors value the earlier models more. Wish I had a random serial one...

[fleabag]

2003,Flat 4


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[beshannon]

Originally Posted by onshow

The first 16610LV's were sold in 2003 but the first sub was released in 1954 at Baselworld so a 2003 16610LV would make it 49 years since the first sub so it begs the question are the 2004 model/purchased 16610LV's the genuine 50th Anniversary models and the ones that are most desirable?

So you are basing this distinction on sales date rather than production date?

[subtona]

Personally I don't think it makes all that much difference.

As long as it is an LV and in good shape that should be what drives price.

If it is from this year or that ; if the bezel is lime green or green... no big deal.


I'll take the best price for the best condition LV available if I was looking.

More of a significant decision for me would be with or without the engraved rehaut.

Or with or without the double serial number stamps.

[fleabag]

Beautiful


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[onshow]

Originally Posted by Loevhagen

Funny thread. :)

Then the Y-series 16610LV from late 2002 is not worth much.

From my research the first Y-series was late 2003.

[onshow]

Originally Posted by beshannon

So you are basing this distinction on sales date rather than production date?

Going by the release date. Rolex released its first sub in 1954 at baselworld.

[meganfox17]

Originally Posted by subtona

Personally I don't think it makes all that much difference. As long as it is an LV and in good shape that should be what drives price. If it is from this year or that ; if the bezel is lime green or green... no big deal.
I'll take the best price for the best condition LV available if I was looking

You have made a very astute observation Sir that it is the pristine condition of any Kermit 16610LV that plays a major role in the driving the price upwards. Here's prove. The photos below show an original all authenticated BNIB NOS Kermit 2015. Yes ! Dated 2015 ! with full protective stickers intact fitted with its plastic bezel currently for sale in the Far East and the most expensive Kermit available on the international market as of mid Nov 2017 (Source: Hong Kong Watch Fever FB + blogger HK Watch Snob) retailing at HK$ 150 000 or US$ 19.2 K ! That's an extra US$ 5 K more expensive than its nearest competitor, a preowned Kermit Flat 4 F in super minty condition with papers dated early 2004 if I'm not mistaken. So I believe a Kermit is worth whatever a buyer is willing to stump out and the physical appearance of the timepiece itself (Unpolished, sharp lines on casing,lugs etc )

Of course the OP is entitled to provide his argumentative points on why 2004 should be declared as the true 50th Anniversary but I'm afraid that will go against the exhaustive research done by leading experts on the matter and contradict opinions of well known Rolex Watch Connoisseurs around the world...

http://www.network54.com/Forum/20759...ary+Submariner

[Godfather111]

Mine is the 2008 M series. Not flat 4, and it has the more modern Rolex etching on the rehaut (or flange).

I actually preferred it over the original 2004 version, and still do. I refer to the first rule of watch collecting, buy what you like. And I love that it has that modern etching detail on a 5-digit Rolex.

I don't think anyone looking at it would say, hey that's not really a 50th anniversary. If someone does, then I would just walk away and leave them talking to air.

[onshow]

Beautiful examples of the 50th Anniversary right there.

Agree all 16610lv's are 50th Anniversary models. It comes down to what year collectors wish to place more importance on hence the increase in value which spreads across all year models.

Good luck all

[mjg002]

Originally Posted by meganfox17

You have made a very astute observation Sir that it is the pristine condition of any Kermit 16610LV that plays a major role in the driving the price upwards. Here's prove. The photos below show an original all authenticated BNIB NOS Kermit 2015. Yes ! Dated 2015 ! with full protective stickers intact fitted with its plastic bezel currently for sale in the Far East and the most expensive Kermit available on the international market as of mid Nov 2017 (Source: Hong Kong Watch Fever FB + blogger HK Watch Snob) retailing at HK$ 150 000 or US$ 19.2 K ! That's an extra US$ 5 K more expensive than its nearest competitor, a preowned Kermit Flat 4 F in super minty condition with papers dated early 2004 if I'm not mistaken. So I believe a Kermit is worth whatever a buyer is willing to stump out and the physical appearance of the timepiece itself (Unpolished, sharp lines on casing,lugs etc )

Of course the OP is entitled to provide his argumentative points on why 2004 should be declared as the true 50th Anniversary but I'm afraid that will go against the exhaustive research done by leading experts on the matter and contradict opinions of well known Rolex Watch Connoisseurs around the world...

http://www.network54.com/Forum/20759...ary+Submariner

"...the most expensive Kermit available on the international market as of mid Nov 2017."
I don't think so.... Watchfinder in the UK has two currently priced at GBP 15,950 (USD 21,373 at current exchange rate).... One is effectively a BNIB watch with stickers in place from 2011 and the other a used Flat 4 from 2004. Just as info...

[rudestew]

No brainer I pinched begged and borrowed to make sure I had my Sd 50th this year , can you imagine giving the wife an anniversary gift one day late . Let’s stick to the time rules here it’s the launch date +50 , you have less than three weeks to grab your SD43 ( that’s if you want the red lol) .

[aquatimerfla]

Originally Posted by rudestew

No brainer I pinched begged and borrowed to make sure I had my Sd 50th this year , can you imagine giving the wife an anniversary gift one day late . Let’s stick to the time rules here it’s the launch date +50 , you have less than three weeks to grab your SD43 ( that’s if you want the red lol) .

Too bad other than sales receipt no one would ever know now that Rolex has random serials

[rudestew]

I suppose its a personal thing then .

[aquatimerfla]

Well truth be told the reality is no one owns the 'actual' 50th anniversary submariner. Only Rolex does.


http://www.rolexmagazine.com/2011/06...ubmariner.html


The original first produced 50th anniversary submariner 'prototype' has lug holes. The production ones do not.

So although collectors etc value different serial #s differently the reality is they are all 50th anniversary 'models'.

[whizz]

I bought F serial 16610LV because I prefer the bezel insert to be lime green colour compared to the later serial which has emerald green

Its a bit difficult to source one at the moment, so I think just grab any available at fair price

[subtona]

Originally Posted by whizz

I bought F serial 16610LV because I prefer the bezel insert to be lime green colour compared to the later serial which has emerald green

Its a bit difficult to source one at the moment, so I think just grab any available at fair price

Curios, Does anyone think Rolex is sitting on lime green bezel insert replacements specifically for the next service of the first run LVs?

[oldman2005]

I think all 1st generation LV are 50th Anv Subs. Rolex did not say only Flat4 are 50th sub.

[SMD]

Originally Posted by onshow

From my research the first Y-series was late 2003.

I have an F flat four with December 2003 papers. FWIW

[mocheen]

I have a F Flat 4 as well with box and papers. I have worn it maybe a dozen times. It has been siting in my watch box all this time. I purchased it to be able to hand it down to my son one day. I think it would be a great graduation present for him. I purchased it when he was still a baby. I only bought it to be different as everybody I know has a black submariner. I mostly wear my Apple watch as a daily and my Panerai on the weekends.