Sub lost an unusual amount of time overnight. Why?

[Mal H.]

First, let me say I'm not freaking out or worried. I'm just curious.

I've been monitoring my new Sub for a couple of weeks now. It's gotten into a rhythm of gaining about a second a day and, when placed crown down, loses about a second over night. In other words, its precision has been perfect.

Last night, however, it seems to have lost 4 or 5 seconds. What might cause a watch to lose an unusual (but still acceptable) amount of time in such a short period?

[kieselguhr]

126610 with 3235 movement?

[csaltphoto]

Could be at the end of it's power reserve. I've had it happen to me. Just wind it every few days to keep it topped off. I tend to give it 20-30 winds every few evenings before bed.

[Mal H.]

Originally Posted by kieselguhr

126610 with 3235 movement?

Sorry, should have specified. 16610 with 3135.

[Haveapair]

Have you ever seen Christopher Nolan's Interstellar movie?

That's what happens when you get too close to a black hole. Time slows relative to the rest of the universe.

Be careful

[Mal H.]

Originally Posted by csaltphoto

Could be at the end of it's power reserve. I've had it happen to me. Just wind it every few days to keep it topped off. I tend to give it 20-30 winds every few evenings before bed.

Not disagreeing, but I walked A LOT yesterday. Pretty much on my feet non-stop for 10 hours.

[Mal H.]

Originally Posted by Haveapair

Have you ever seen Christopher Nolan's Interstellar movie?

That's what happens when you get too close to a black hole. Time slows relative to the rest of the universe.

Be careful

Not a black hole, but I was working around a massive electromagnet yesterday.

https://youtu.be/Fw_drI7bMvw

[Oxfordian]

Originally Posted by Mal H.

Not disagreeing, but I walked A LOT yesterday. Pretty much on my feet non-stop for 10 hours.

It’s that unreliable 3135 movement, it never has been much cop.

[shipitfresh]

My DJ41 (3235) is overall great for accuracy. Usually a second or so fast per week. Sometimes when it suddenly loses 2-3 seconds in a couple days, I'll wind it a few turns (20-30) and that seems to get it back on track. BTW, I keep it on the crown down at night.

[MasonDixon]

Originally Posted by Mal H.

Sorry, should have specified. 16610 with 3135.

Do you know the service history? It's been a while since the watch was manufactured.

[Mystro]

Originally Posted by Mal H.

Not disagreeing, but I walked A LOT yesterday. Pretty much on my feet non-stop for 10 hours.

Doesn’t necessarily mean there isn’t an issue with your rotor efficiency. Wind the watch 40-50 times and recheck.

[Tools]

What time source did you check it with ?

[904VT]

Originally Posted by csaltphoto

Could be at the end of it's power reserve. I've had it happen to me. Just wind it every few days to keep it topped off. I tend to give it 20-30 winds every few evenings before bed.

Originally Posted by Mal H.

Not a black hole, but I was working around a massive electromagnet yesterday.

https://youtu.be/Fw_drI7bMvw

I think Csalt is correct here. IMO 99% probability it was low power reserve. This is a normal characteristic. Just wearing the watch sometimes will surprise you how little it gets wound and charged up. 40 full turn when winding will get you a full power reserve. But with Rolex, just wind until you feel the skipping since you cannot overwind a modern Rolex. Regarding electromagnetic influences, I would say those would cause opposite impact with increasing rate of timekeeping not losing time.

[Mal H.]

Originally Posted by MasonDixon

Do you know the service history? It's been a while since the watch was manufactured.

Made in 2010. Unserviced, but also unworn until it got to me.

[Mal H.]

Originally Posted by Tools

What time source did you check it with ?

time.gov on a couple of devices

[saxo3]

The 3135 is a very reliable caliber.
Full winding, then onto a timegrapher and you will get an answer.

[Mal H.]

Originally Posted by 904VT

I think Csalt is correct here. IMO 99% probability it was low power reserve. This is a normal characteristic. Just wearing the watch sometimes will surprise you how little it gets wound and charged up. 40 full turn when winding will get you a full power reserve. But with Rolex, just wind until you feel the skipping since you cannot overwind a modern Rolex. Regarding electromagnetic influences, I would say those would cause opposite impact with increasing rate of timekeeping not losing time.

Good to know. I was under the impression that a watch worn daily didn't need top offs. I had planned to top off only when I had the crown open for other reasons (most notably to reset the date every couple of months).

[Tools]

Originally Posted by Mal H.

time.gov on a couple of devices

It is likely then, that it lost/gained time at some point during the day. Excessive or continuous movement against the hairspring (momentum changes), magnetic fields, temperature changes, all may affect timekeeping at any point, briefly.

You are seeing that change the next day when you check and assuming that it all took place over night.

Or, are you checking it when you put it down, then re-checking in the morning (overnight). If so, then your timing is taking place over 8-12 hours, and not 24hrs, as is customary. That's a whole different issue.

The right way to check timing is to check once with a reliable source, then re-check several days later, finally, dividing by the days to reach your average 24 hour timing. Constantly checking doesn't really tell you much, except that timing is dynamic - and we all should know that.

[Mal H.]

Originally Posted by Tools

It is likely then, that it lost/gained time at some point during the day. Excessive or continuous movement against the hairspring (momentum changes), magnetic fields, temperature changes, all may affect timekeeping at any point, briefly.

You are seeing that change the next day when you check and assuming that it all took place over night.

Or, are you checking it when you put it down, then re-checking in the morning (overnight). If so, then your timing is taking place over 8-12 hours, and not 24hrs, as is customary. That's a whole different issue.

The right way to check timing is to check once with a reliable source, then re-check several days later, finally, dividing by the days to reach your average 24 hour timing. Constantly checking doesn't really tell you much, except that timing is dynamic - and we all should know that.

I check it at night to decide how to place it on the night stand and then again in the morning to check the results. It has settled into a rhythm of +1 sec over the course of the day and then -1 sec when crown down over night.

There have been days when it was -1 sec over the course of the day and when left dial up it has gained it back overnight.

Again, I'm not worried and I'm definitely not planning on doing this long term. I'm just having fun with the new watch and was curious why there would be such an out-of-family reading after so many consistent days.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by Mal H.

First, let me say I'm not freaking out or worried. I'm just curious.

I've been monitoring my new Sub for a couple of weeks now. It's gotten into a rhythm of gaining about a second a day and, when placed crown down, loses about a second over night. In other words, its precision has been perfect.

Last night, however, it seems to have lost 4 or 5 seconds. What might cause a watch to lose an unusual (but still acceptable) amount of time in such a short period?

Would hardly call 4-5 seconds lost out of 86400 seconds in a day a unusual amount of time for any mechanical watch.

[Mal H.]

Originally Posted by padi56

Would hardly call 4-5 seconds lost out of 86400 seconds in a day a unusual amount of time for any mechanical watch.

I've tried to make it clear that I consider it unusual because it's out of family with previous data, not because 4-5 seconds is an issue in and of itself.

[watchmaker]

Originally Posted by saxo3

The 3135 is a very reliable caliber.
Full winding, then onto a timegrapher and you will get an answer.

A timegrapher can tell you if your watch needs a service; but it can never tell you that a watch doesn’t need one.

[watchmaker]

Many things can affect timekeeping temporarily. One instance of unusual behaviour isn’t enough to make any meaningful comment or diagnosis.

If it starts to repeat the behaviour; then there’s some problem solving to be done

[Mal H.]

Originally Posted by watchmaker

A timegrapher can tell you if your watch needs a service; but it can never tell you that a watch doesn’t need one.

For the record, my watch was always headed for a service regardless of its performance. RSC is closed down until the 14th, though, so it's on my wrist.

[Oystersteel92]

Originally Posted by Mal H.

For the record, my watch was always headed for a service regardless of its performance. RSC is closed down until the 14th, though, so it's on my wrist.

I totally agree with you. Any watch that's sat for 10 years goes off to Service in my opinion. Also, if I get a watch and don't have the service history, it goes. That's my policy.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by watchmaker

A timegrapher can tell you if your watch needs a service; but it can never tell you that a watch doesn’t need one.

Since you are an acknowledged and appreciated TechXpert here, I leave this statement uncontradicted.

[watchmaker]

Originally Posted by saxo3

Since you are an acknowledged and appreciated TechXpert here, I leave this statement uncontradicted.

I’m quite happy to elaborate

A timegrapher gives a snapshot of how a watch is running at the time it is tested, of particular interest is: the average rate, delta, amplitude and beat error.

Let’s assume you have a timegrapher reading which has given out some favourable looking numbers in each category. One might assume “hey, it’s all good”, when in reality there’s a good bit more information required before a watchmaker would say the watch doesn’t need (or wouldn’t benefit from) a service.

Some information I want before making a recommendation:

Automatic winding test
0hour (full power) timegrapher test
24hour timegrapher test
Power reserve check
Function test (chronograph, date, calendar, repeater, etc)
Visual inspection of movement (does it look clean, no rust/dust/metal fragments)
Oil condition and quantity still good
Water resistance test

Finally; are parts still being made for this watch. If so, you can in theory get away with leaving it until it stops. If parts are no longer available my recommendation would be to stick to a regular service cycle since you want your existing parts to last as long as possible and avoid any wear or damage.

Ultimately a watch can have good results on a timegrapher and fail multiple other inspection points that I’ve listed - in which case my advice would be the watch would benefit from a service.

[Easy E]

Solar flares.

[Posh Gentleman]

low power reserve. this happens to my gmt quite often also, even if I wear the watch throughout the day. I like winding my watches, so no prob for me. lol

[Rolex.Journey]

Get a watch winder and keep in there and track the time keeping. I set all my watches in there and can easily tell if time is slipping on one of them in comparison to the rest


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