Estimated Value of 1969 submariner

[Jsorof]

Hello,
My father-in-law just gifted me a Rolex Submariner that his wife gave to him in 1969 in Vietnam. He has no box or papers, and I am unwilling to remove the bracelet to see the reference number for fear of damaging the watch. It has barely been worn and the case is almost pristine although it could use a good cleaning and the bracelet has some wear and tear. Although I have no intention of selling, I am trying to get a sense of the value for insurance purposes and general sense of whether it is too valuable to wear on a routine basis. The only markings on the back are "8208", "18k", and "503B". Pics attached. Any ideas appreciated.
Thanks!

[Tools]

Enjoy wearing your heirloom without fear.

Unfortunately, it is not an authentic Rolex, it is a fake; on the bright side it is not too valuable to wear.

[Masteryacht]

No offense to you, but that is an abomination.

[1665fan]

Too scared to remove the bracelet……..because it will probably break lol ��

[henrylee]

It’s a fake I’m sorry

[mkruger311]

That's a fake watch.

[brandrea]

Welcome to the forum

[GGGMT]

Ayayay eesh ack. Very not bueno. Welcome to the forum, though and hope you enjoy the learning here!


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[rolex_DateJust]

The font is very beautiful

[1665fan]

So in 1969 they faked a 1990s sub….. man those guys were some forward thinkers ROFL!!!!!

[sbybbuser]

Originally Posted by 1665fan

So in 1969 they faked a 1990s sub….. man those guys were some forward thinkers ROFL!!!!!

This watch must be the protoype.


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[PRSWILL]

Pulp Fiction comes to mind.

[alweisenberger]

18 karat steel, rare!

[Jsorof]

Well, that is indeed a surprise. I have my own watch collection so I am not that emotionally invested in this watch but I know my father-in-law is. I won't tell him!

I know for a fact that he received this watch in 1969 as gift from his wife and has been keeping it in a drawer for 50 years. He has always assumed that it is authentic. Were people making fake Rolexes back then as well? I have never paid much attention to the replica market but does that story add up? How can one tell that it is fake?

[Jsorof]

Originally Posted by PRSWILL

Pulp Fiction comes to mind.

That's awesome. LOL.

[Jsorof]

After all the comments, I took the bracelet off to see if there was an engraved serial or model number between the lugs. Nope. Just 8208. Since I am 100% sure he has had this watch since 1969, seems like he got a replica watch back then and never knew it. Oh well, easy come easy go. I won't tell him though. It would break his 80 year old heart.

[GGGMT]

Originally Posted by Jsorof

After all the comments, I took the bracelet off to see if there was an engraved serial or model number between the lugs. Nope. Just 8208. Since I am 100% sure he has had this watch since 1969, seems like he got a replica watch back then and never knew it. Oh well, easy come easy go. I won't tell him though. It would break his 80 year old heart.

The weird thing is, per post #10, it’s a fake replica of a 1990s watch. Meaning that it has features of a watch that came much later than 1969. For example, the lume plots are surrounded by metal, which didn’t exist back in the 60s or 70s. So, if somebody truly faked to this watch back in the 60s, they would’ve had to “see the future” of what Rolex was going to do design-wise 20-30 years later. Not likely. Additionally, I don’t think these watches were faked back in the 60s.


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[Jsorof]

Originally Posted by GGGMT

The weird thing is, per post #10, it’s a fake replica of a 1990s watch. Meaning that it has features of a watch that came much later than 1969. For example, the lume plots are surrounded by metal, which didn’t exist back in the 60s or 70s. So, if somebody truly faked to this watch back in the 60s, they would’ve had to “see the future” of what Rolex was going to do design-wise 20-30 years later. Not likely. Additionally, I don’t think these watches were faked back in the 60s.


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Yes, I am trying to make this whole thing make sense. The owner is a now 80-year old vietnamese man who got this watch from his wife as a wedding gift in 1969. My wife has confirmed the story. He swears it has never left his possession, even to have it cleaned or serviced. He doesn't wear it and has kept it in a drawer for decades. He has no sophistication about watches at all and has never expressed interest in selling it. He was shocked when I told him what it might be worth (if it had been real). How could it have been faked to 90's style font or specs in 1969? It just doesn't make any sense.

[101031-28]

Originally Posted by GGGMT

The weird thing is, per post #10, it’s a fake replica of a 1990s watch. Meaning that it has features of a watch that came much later than 1969. For example, the lume plots are surrounded by metal, which didn’t exist back in the 60s or 70s. So, if somebody truly faked to this watch back in the 60s, they would’ve had to “see the future” of what Rolex was going to do design-wise 20-30 years later. Not likely. Additionally, I don’t think these watches were faked back in the 60s.

Spot on

[GGGMT]

Very odd indeed. Maybe scour his belongings for another watch — cuz if it’s there from 1969, it’ll be amazing. Good luck!


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[1665fan]

Originally Posted by GGGMT

Very odd indeed. Maybe scour his belongings for another watch — cuz if it’s there from 1969, it’ll be amazing. Good luck!


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Yea there’s probably a real 1969 Rolex laying somewhere, maybe yours or mine…..not in his closet though

[Letsgodiving]

I guess it's possible someone could have realized the value of the original and switched it out with a fake thinking the owner would not notice the difference. They are similar to an untrained eye. That would unfortunately point to a family member or close friend. Hopefully that's not the case

[Jsorof]

Likely my last post on this topic as it seems this watch is clearly a not very good replica, although there is still some mystery around how this came to be at all. After cleaning, here is what it is.

[S52]

Originally Posted by GGGMT

The weird thing is, per post #10, it’s a fake replica of a 1990s watch. Meaning that it has features of a watch that came much later than 1969. For example, the lume plots are surrounded by metal, which didn’t exist back in the 60s or 70s. So, if somebody truly faked to this watch back in the 60s, they would’ve had to “see the future” of what Rolex was going to do design-wise 20-30 years later. Not likely. Additionally, I don’t think these watches were faked back in the 60s.


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Depth rating is wrong too. 1680 subs of that era would have been marked 200M/660 ft.

No way this replica was made in ‘69.

Maybe he had a real sub and a relative or someone swapped it out for this one thinking he might not notice?
Thats my guess.

[GGGMT]

Yep pics confirm fake.


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[Jsorof]

Well, that is an even sadder version of the story but the only plausible explanation. Out of curiosity, if it had truly been a 1969 sub without box/papers but in very good condition, what would it have been worth?

Not to be a heretic, but I am more of a Panerai/JLC/Maurice LaCroix kind of guy on the high end side of my own collection...;-)

[freefly]

Originally Posted by Jsorof

Since I am 100% sure he has had this watch since 1969, seems like he got a replica watch back then and never knew it.

As others have mentioned, that really isn't possible. If the story is not completely made-up, then he is either "misremembering", and/or the story applies to a different watch.
Or, an opportunist (thief) may have swapped out a real one for that junk some time along the way (well after 1969).

[Jsorof]

Originally Posted by freefly

As others have mentioned, that really isn't possible. If the story is not completely made-up, then he is either "misremembering", and/or the story applies to a different watch.
Or, an opportunist (thief) may have swapped out a real one for that junk some time along the way (well after 1969).

Seems like the consensus is that someone stole his original watch. I feel sad for him because he has cherished that watch for so long. I won't be telling him...

[Roddypeepa]

Well back in late 60s it would have been rated to 200m and probably been single red submariner text.

Imagine would be worth 30k plus depending on condition if real. Shame.


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[Old Expat Beast]

Also, caseback says 18K for gold, and it's got a flat glass crystal. This is a fairly modern fake, though they have been around since at least the late 1930s (I have a Hong Kong newspaper cutting from 1940 about people being arrested for selling them).